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  • "Political" Discussions

    Starting this in the Lounge to save the mods the trouble I guess.

    I guess I'm part of Team Lib (along w/ my bro Zaphod) that is causing all of the frustration?

    I'm genuinely mystified by the type of conversation that is either desired or possible as we talk about tax policy, a highly partisan topic that affects us all so much. I don't spend any time on Bogleheads but maybe I should?

    What does a non political discussion of tax policy look like?

    Could someone who is getting frustrated by the political stuff please clarify this?

  • #2
    If you even start typing the word politics at BH you'll be gone.

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    • #3




       

      What does a non political discussion of tax policy look like?
      Click to expand...


      It's a discussion of the tax policy purely on its merits without consideration of motives, intents, personalities or parties.

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      • #4







         

        What does a non political discussion of tax policy look like?
        Click to expand…


        It’s a discussion of the tax policy purely on its merits without consideration of motives, intents, personalities or parties.
        Click to expand...


        Merits meaning what? Just describing exactly how it affects my return?

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        • #5
          Why are you dragging zaphod into this?

           

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          • #6










             

            What does a non political discussion of tax policy look like?
            Click to expand…


            It’s a discussion of the tax policy purely on its merits without consideration of motives, intents, personalities or parties.
            Click to expand…


            Merits meaning what? Just describing exactly how it affects my return?
            Click to expand...


            Not just that.  How it effects you is relevant, but also its effect on the economy as a whole, effect on subgroups, etc.  Just leave the parties and personalities out.

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            • #7










               

              What does a non political discussion of tax policy look like?
              Click to expand…


              It’s a discussion of the tax policy purely on its merits without consideration of motives, intents, personalities or parties.
              Click to expand…


              Merits meaning what? Just describing exactly how it affects my return?
              Click to expand...


              You seriously don’t know how to think about taxes without involving politics?  If so, that sums up why it would be pointless to have a political debate with you.

              Anyway, I don’t care if you guys want to waste time debating politics.  I just skip over these posts.  But with so many new threads getting derailed by these pointless debates that significantly detract from actually helping people with their finances, I expect political discussions to be shut down more and more frequently.

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              • #8
                The political back-and-forth is inevitably both acrimonious and unproductive.

                Some people enjoy it, but there are many available outlets for that pursuit. I'd prefer it if this forum was not one of them (but that isn't up to me).

                It's like smoking, which causes both cancer and bad breath. Nevertheless, some people seem to enjoy it. In my youth, smokers lit up in restaurants and blew smoke across their neighbor's table. These days, they smoke elsewhere. Non-smokers can now enjoy smoke-free meals. It's a good thing.
                Erstwhile Dance Theatre of Dayton performer cum bellhop. Carried (many) bags for a lovely and gracious 59 yo Cyd Charisse. (RIP) Hosted epic company parties after Friday night rehearsals.

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                • #9
                  Yeah, tried to have a strictly budget item question answered without the politics getting dragged into it.

                  You'd think in a financial minded forum that this would be a simple discussion; yet it didn't 

                  All I see is fiscal responsibility has largely been ignored in this tax reform bill.  It's borrowing against our future and antithesis to WCI on that merit.

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                  • #10







                     

                    What does a non political discussion of tax policy look like?
                    Click to expand…


                    It’s a discussion of the tax policy purely on its merits without consideration of motives, intents, personalities or parties.
                    Click to expand...


                    What?  This is ridiculous.  The merits of a particular tax policy (especially regarding the things you listed: "effects on the economy as a whole" and "effects on subgroups") is like a quintessential political question.

                     

                     

                     

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                    • #11
                      The political rants of late on WCI have driven me away. I have zero interest in getting involved in that stuff. So, I have found some good new blogs that I spend time on that do not tolerate political histrionics.

                       

                       

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                      • #12
                        Even though I enjoy discussions of tax policy, which inevitably deviates into politics, I will refrain going forward from any political posts. I get that it annoys many and want to respect those that put the hard work into setting up this forum and moderating.

                        But threads that start like “Please help me with Senate/CBO Math”, are just asking for trouble because we all know the question and answer are by nature political.

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                        • #13
                          I think these threads quickly get sidetracked from simple math questions to values based or subjective opinions. Things swerve from the positive to the normative all too quickly.

                          “I make $X00,000 a year as a W-2 wage earner. Will my taxes go up or down?”

                          vs.

                          “Should carried interest be taxed as ordinary income in the year it is earned?”

                          Where things start to go off the rails is with political questions of who should pay how much and for what. We also have problems with seemingly neutral math questions like how much a given proposal is likely to raise or lower the deficit, whether we’ll need a future change in tax policy to make up for the debt, deficit, or changes in demographics, and the track record of the group making the forecast about an uncertain future.

                          One side will point to a Congressional Budget Office forecast of a $1.5 trillion dollar increase in the federal debt over the course of a decade. The other side will argue that the CBO missed the mark badly with the affordability of the Affordable Care Act.

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                          • #14










                             

                            What does a non political discussion of tax policy look like?
                            Click to expand…


                            It’s a discussion of the tax policy purely on its merits without consideration of motives, intents, personalities or parties.
                            Click to expand…


                            What?  This is ridiculous.  The merits of a particular tax policy (especially regarding the things you listed: “effects on the economy as a whole” and “effects on subgroups”) is like a quintessential political question.

                             

                             

                             
                            Click to expand...


                            respectfully, using words like ridiculous are how things start to spiral out of control.  there are obviously bright people who take a different position than you.  are you able to state your position without utilizing inflammatory words?  we get that you disagree with the comment.  i do appreciate that you state the comment is ridiculous rather than the poster.

                             

                             

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                            • #15
                              I like politics but I try hard to keep my views to myself on this forum.  Political rants belong elsewhere.  People should strive to be nice and informative.

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