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primary care docs, i want your input/opinion/answers..how much do you gross per day?

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  • #16
    it is difficult to compare part time work with full time work, I would consider 26 hours part time, as a physician, there are a lot of fixed costs for running an office whether you are there 20 hours or 80 hours a weeks. Your fixed costs don't change that much but your increment costs are only change a small amount with increasing volume of patients. So basically if you are going to work a slower schedule your fixed cost still need to come out of the number which some bean counter will readjust your price per wRVU rate to adjust for that. Your wRVU may be low just because of that reason alone, or may just be due to local factors of employment and competition in your area.

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    • #17
      Since you asked, average is about $1000 a day, but I'm academic FM, so some days I work more and others less.

      I don't know that this question makes a whole lot of sense though. A working day can be 4-12 hours depending on your location, so hourly rates seem to be the natural thing to compare.

      As someone pointed out, if you are on wrvu production, simply looking at production rates x rvu comp should get you what you need.

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      • #18
        You seem to have a unique situation that would be hard to compare to.

        I am an employee family doc. I work 36 contact hours a week. I average about 20-22 patients per day. I get paid on production based on collections. The pay varies but other than the initial covid slump it has been upper 200 to low 300s a year. 150 bucks an hour more or less. Middle of the road health benefits and a 3% 403b match.

        Sorry I didn't respond sooner I was rolling around in the money from my CBD side hustle

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Lordosis View Post
          You seem to have a unique situation that would be hard to compare to.

          I am an employee family doc. I work 36 contact hours a week. I average about 20-22 patients per day. I get paid on production based on collections. The pay varies but other than the initial covid slump it has been upper 200 to low 300s a year. 150 bucks an hour more or less. Middle of the road health benefits and a 3% 403b match.

          Sorry I didn't respond sooner I was rolling around in the money from my CBD side hustle
          Thanks lordosis for actually answering my question and not getting on a soapbox like some of the others on here…

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Tim View Post
            Well, you can ask wrvu rate, how many patients per day, what is your avg wrvu per encounter or whatever you wish.
            wrvu rate is the most common. Or base with incentive. Just with respect, it is difficult to gather samples.
            Hint: MGMA does not do it for free.
            I have mgma data, and it was FREE I just had to find out who to ask.

            “Difficult”… u don’t say. It’s like pulling teeth to get anyone to discuss comp even through the internet with so much anonymity

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            • #21
              Originally posted by familydocPA View Post
              Since you asked, average is about $1000 a day, but I'm academic FM, so some days I work more and others less.

              I don't know that this question makes a whole lot of sense though. A working day can be 4-12 hours depending on your location, so hourly rates seem to be the natural thing to compare.

              As someone pointed out, if you are on wrvu production, simply looking at production rates x rvu comp should get you what you need.
              I wanted to ask what I asked. Pay per day is what is important to me so I can compare. For ex some of my colleagues work 9 hr days and see 20 pts. I can see 20 pts in 4hrs.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by Savedfpdoc View Post

                I wanted to ask what I asked. Pay per day is what is important to me so I can compare. For ex some of my colleagues work 9 hr days and see 20 pts. I can see 20 pts in 4hrs.
                20 pts in 4 hrs billing 4s/5s?

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by StarTrekDoc View Post
                  Op, yes this is a simple question and the issue is that folk, even in a financial forum that understands the importance of knowledge is power.... individual compensation reamins a third rail for many and that's the ultimate advantage to the employer.

                  since I've lived forever in a public institution, my salary has always been transparent, so easily state this publicly. This is not the norm.

                  As tim pointed out, many factors go into a daily earning rate. As you figured out later, you stated some .... Rvus, $per rvu, number patients number hours worked, benefits. Then you average daily.

                  Perhaps adjusting your op will help with responses.... probably not, but more.useful information at responses.

                  ​​​​​​Ultimately, you need local specific information. As pointed before, your dollar per rvu appears lowish and root cause of the issue. Do the local legwork
                  The question I asked would give me what I need to compare, I have the mgma data, so I know my rvu rate is low. “Local legwork”.. my rvu rate is more than avg for my local

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by StarTrekDoc View Post

                    20 pts in 4 hrs billing 4s/5s?
                    Darn right

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Savedfpdoc View Post

                      I wanted to ask what I asked. Pay per day is what is important to me so I can compare. For ex some of my colleagues work 9 hr days and see 20 pts. I can see 20 pts in 4hrs.
                      As a PCP, do you feel like you’re giving not only good care but the care your patients need? That seems like a lot of important things will wind up falling through the cracks.

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Savedfpdoc View Post

                        Darn right
                        20 99214/99215s in 4 hours in family med? You sure you’re giving good care to those patients?

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Savedfpdoc View Post

                          I wanted to ask what I asked. Pay per day is what is important to me so I can compare. For ex some of my colleagues work 9 hr days and see 20 pts. I can see 20 pts in 4hrs.
                          Doesnt the math here mean you are working part time but seeing the same amount of patients as a full timer? If you are seeing patients twice as fast...

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                          • #28
                            I'm not FP so my answer wouldn't help, but I have very few days like the OP is looking for, M-F 8-5 no meetings, no admin, etc. I just have one day like that per week. Based on that day if it's very busy and I have no no-shows I can make $2500. But most days aren't that busy, and I'm paid less to do everything else I do - admin, inpatient, call - so my hourly rate is nowhere near $300. Nor would I want it to be - 40 hours a week of breakneck back to back outpatients is just brutal.

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                            • #29
                              3 yr post residency.
                              FM outpt, no OB. Mid sized city
                              In my first year with current organization.
                              $115/hr during the guarantee period.

                              Afterwards, guesstimating in the $140-170/hr based off collections. Haven't calculated what quality metrics would add.

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                              • #30
                                I can envision (but would not enjoy) 5 patients per hour 99214. Suspicious if you do no 99213’s as an FP. I would be very interested to know how many 99215’s you see, and please PM me or post about some typical 99215’s. Clearly you aren’t doing that by time. I see a lot of complicated patients and it’s possible I under code (our compliance person is famously conservative). If in fact you see 20 99214’s in 4 hours, you’ve gotta be above 95% mgma.

                                I'm in a desirable city hence pay is lower. I think I’m circa 150/hr.

                                Also: I spent a year above 90%tile mgma and it was great for burnout and bad for my family. I’m much happier working less.

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