Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Afraid of success

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #31
    Originally posted by childay View Post

    Not sure much rhymes with husband..
    That was my big issue…

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by Silverdoc View Post
      Slowly however I've been sensing some grumblings of discontent. My wife no longer likes her job, and wants to quit. Now maybe the house is too small for her taste, or the taste of her family who would visit. The kids are growing up, and perhaps need less time with us on a daily basis. I still love spending time with them.

      I've now been confronted with questions on whether we should invest more in real estate, whether active or passive. I am attending courses offered by Peter Kim, and trying to broaden my horizons. However, I've not had a natural liking for it. But its benefits of cashflow, more independence are things that appeal to me.

      There are some things that hold me back: the idea that more success is "unnecessary", or that more success will not make us happier. I suspect this to be true, as I've never really found happiness in things and possessions. That's why I resist trying to learn about real estate, or taking the plunge in buying direct real estate, because I doubt it will have significantly positive effects on our happiness. But are there benefits? Yes of course, some additional money for the kids to go to school, some more security. But I'm not sure if aiming for more 'success' will cause more harm than good, to me, my relationships, our time. Does that make sense?

      The grumblings are getting louder it seems. My physician wife is more and more unhappy as a PCP. I'd love to support her, and have asked her to quit her job. But she is aware of how important the goal of FI is to me, and for our household, and that her quitting this early in the game will delay that goal much longer. For the last few years all her income has gone to savings/investments.

      I am afraid too that I'm just burying my head in the sand, wanting to keep things as they are, not recognizing that my family is changing, maybe moving on while I'm still here stuck in the happiness of the past.

      Any helpful insights? Have you experienced this before?
      1. Real estate is not easy money. It is hard work and the returns may not be any better than investing in the stock market. You might even lose money if the interest rates rise sharply, tenants don't pay, trash the place etc. The one person sure to make money through all this is Peter Kim.

      2. You can't have the cake and eat it too. There cannot be a substantial drop in income when your physician wife quits and also at the same time try and get a bigger house in this hot housing market. Money does not grow on trees. Either she quits and you budget for the reduced monthly paycheck or she brings in the dough monthly and you upgrade the house.

      3. Finally both have to be on the same page as to the end goals and if one feels that they are being taken advantage of, it leads to long simmering resentment that is unhealthy.

      4. A bigger house is not a bad idea if you feel cramped with 2 children and visiting family but then the income should be there to make that purchase.

      Good luck.

      Comment


      • #33
        Agree with the others. There is plenty to be unhappy with right now in this stressful time. It is not likely that you will have a simple fix.

        There is no need to change your strategy for the sake of changing. You are plenty successful now. Just try to see what can be adjusted so you both can enjoy the journey together.

        Comment


        • #34
          I know this is a personal finance forum, but I recommend taking some time to really think about what your definition of success really is. Does being successful mean having a certain net worth or amount in your brokerage? Personally, I like this quote by Emerson :

          "What is success? To laugh often and much; to win the respect of intelligent people and the affection of children; to earn the appreciation of honest critics and endure the betrayal of false friends; to appreciate the beauty; to find the best in others; to leave the world a bit better, whether by a healthy child, a garden patch Or a redeemed social condition; to know even one life has breathed easier because you have lived. This is to have succeeded!"

          By that definition alone you are already extraordinarily successful...not even considering your high net worth.

          Comment


          • #35
            Real estate investing isn't for everyone and don't feel you are not a success if you don't do it. You obviously are a success by most anyone's definition. If stock market investment suits your needs then do that and don't live by other's "shoulds".

            Comment


            • #36
              I'd encourage you both read "happiness curve". Sounds like she may be having waves of unhappiness. Looking at house size and material things can sometimes be a distraction for people or an area to blame.
              1. Drop all other thoughts until you find out what your wife needs (not necessarily wants) then set up a goal to pursue that. New career, part time, new job, mindfulness ect...
              reach this goal together. Maybe she could be lead person for real estate.
              2. Maybe you have a goal of FI and retirement but she has no goal. You could find her a goal. If it's a new house sit down and find out how you can structure your financial lives to make that happen. Then she may be more determined/excited about work knowing it is going towards a new goal.

              As physicians we have extreme goal orientated and delayed gratification mindset. You either focus on things like meditation, therapy or distractions to counteract this OR you just find/develop a new goal.

              Comment


              • #37
                Parents around 40.
                Kids 8 and 10.
                Maybe this is not really about jobs or money.
                It is part of passing from one stage of life to the next.
                One’s “midlife “ perceptions for their roles changes. It maybe personal, professional or even her desire to raise the kids., desire to be “Mom”.
                Homework, driver, carpools, PTA whatever she internally feels. Her work/life balance. That needs to be sorted out.
                Where does your family want to be :
                Parents around 50
                Kids 18 and 20.
                And how to get there.
                My wife took 6 years off to reach her goals of being “Mom”. We could afford to do that. She was itching to get back to work when she felt her “Mom job” was done.
                I would suggest you folks look at a 10 year time frame for the work/life balance and see the financial impact. Life stages happen., easier for some than others. Deal with it. If you don’t deal with it, one or both will encounter a “midlife crisis”. That results drastically poorer results or options.
                Off the cuff. she needs to keep her hand in the game for an option to return to full time work.
                Mutual self fulfillment is realistic. It’s just a reset of goals and expectations. Maybe she actually desires to cut out work. Not necessarily lazy, just what her hopes were. You might need counseling to flush that out. If that is her goal, it comes with a cost to be shared. At least you are both on the same page.
                Face it, for most at 40 you realize your life is half over. Tons of emotional baggage is possible.
                Focus in the next 10 years. I was unable to change my wife’s mother hen desires. I admired it and fully committed.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by Notsobad View Post
                  Agree with the others. There is plenty to be unhappy with right now in this stressful time
                  And if a person is suffering from clinical major depression, there is plenty to be unhappy about even in the least-stressful time imaginable. There is truth to the saying "wherever you go, there you are." If the problem is purely internal, changing external things doesn't fix it.

                  Now, I am not saying the OP's wife is suffering from major depression. But it IS a possibility that needs to be kept in mind, especially if doing things like cutting back work hours/changing jobs or moving to a nicer house don't seem to have the desired effect.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Anne View Post
                    Perhaps “marry equal, to avoid the sequel”. I.e. marry someone with similar values to avoid divorce.
                    IMHO, This is more accurate reflection of what the intent of the saying happy spouse and happy wife are and tracks along the saying 'a house divided'

                    op, suggest as others have.... sit down and talk this over with her. What are your goals. What are her goals. Get to the root cause of her current unhappiness. There are plenty of reasons for PCP unhappiness.

                    We went through a similar situation late 30s and wife ended up hanging up her stethoscope to concentrate on family and we've been that way since. But that was OUR solution and you need find out what best path is together to remain together.

                    Advice NOT to complicate it with further money issues in diversified investments. Keep It Simple as much as possible and focus on the fundamentals of the household..... partnership.




                    Comment


                    • #40
                      I always wonder if "happy wife, happy life" is the advice someone gave Macbeth.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by braindoc View Post
                        I know this is a personal finance forum, but I recommend taking some time to really think about what your definition of success really is. Does being successful mean having a certain net worth or amount in your brokerage? Personally, I like this quote by Emerson :

                        "What is success? To laugh often and much; to win the respect of intelligent people and the affection of children; to earn the appreciation of honest critics and endure the betrayal of false friends; to appreciate the beauty; to find the best in others; to leave the world a bit better, whether by a healthy child, a garden patch Or a redeemed social condition; to know even one life has breathed easier because you have lived. This is to have succeeded!"

                        By that definition alone you are already extraordinarily successful...not even considering your high net worth.
                        Emerson. This quote. Mic drop. Thanks for sharing this quote

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          I don't see why it would make more sense for your wife to retire than for you to do so.

                          Kids need role models and seeing both parents working hard at their jobs is critical.

                          Planning on a bigger house with less income is planning for financial failure.

                          Of course your kids needs change. That is part of their growing up. But at their ages, they still need to see you both for serious time every day.

                          I would forget about real estate. Their is a recent WCI post about real estate investing with a long list of comments. A poster "Park" presents very good data against the idea that private RE is any better than buying public REITs. Seems their have been many claims for private RE- higher risk adjusted return than stocks, low volatility, lower correlation with stocks than REITs display. No evidence that any of this is true. Some excellent evidence that it is not.

                          You both need to figure out what you want for the next stage of your lives.

                          I am not you.

                          If I were in your shoes, before thinking about either one of you retiring, I would want to fully fund my retirement and fully fund kids education through graduate or professional school. From what you describe, you have a long way to go before you are there.

                          What constitutes a fully funded retirement depends on how much you spend. If your spending goes up as you accumulate more assets, then you need more money put away.

                          You are years from financial independence and cutting back on work.

                          Again, If I were you, I would keep working while figuring out the source of dissatisfaction. The vast majority of people in the US would love to have your problems

                          But I am not you.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Silverdoc View Post
                            I don't know who else to talk to, without fear of being judged. I can't talk to my family because they don't understand this aspect of physician's lives. I can't talk to my friends because they may think I am subtly flexing, or humble bragging, which I am not. Thank you in advance for being kind.

                            After graduating from fellowship in 2016 my wife and I started working and have since managed to accumulate a net worth of $1.6M. It is not much by the standards of many physicians here, but it was significant for me as our specialties are amongst the lowest paying. We've paid off our house, and have no debt. All the money is in stocks and bonds, and the house we live in. I'm 42 and my wife is 38.

                            For some time I was very happy and content. Our lifestyles were simple, our tastes were inexpensive. Our children, now 10 and 8, have been growing and my wife and I feel very much part of their lives. My work has been satisfying, nothing prestigious or flashy, but I continue to feel that I make a difference in the lives of my patients. I am ready to maintain this simple lifestyle for the rest of my life.

                            Slowly however I've been sensing some grumblings of discontent. My wife no longer likes her job, and wants to quit. Now maybe the house is too small for her taste, or the taste of her family who would visit. The kids are growing up, and perhaps need less time with us on a daily basis. I still love spending time with them.

                            I've now been confronted with questions on whether we should invest more in real estate, whether active or passive. I am attending courses offered by Peter Kim, and trying to broaden my horizons. However, I've not had a natural liking for it. But its benefits of cashflow, more independence are things that appeal to me.

                            There are some things that hold me back: the idea that more success is "unnecessary", or that more success will not make us happier. I suspect this to be true, as I've never really found happiness in things and possessions. That's why I resist trying to learn about real estate, or taking the plunge in buying direct real estate, because I doubt it will have significantly positive effects on our happiness. But are there benefits? Yes of course, some additional money for the kids to go to school, some more security. But I'm not sure if aiming for more 'success' will cause more harm than good, to me, my relationships, our time. Does that make sense?

                            The grumblings are getting louder it seems. My physician wife is more and more unhappy as a PCP. I'd love to support her, and have asked her to quit her job. But she is aware of how important the goal of FI is to me, and for our household, and that her quitting this early in the game will delay that goal much longer. For the last few years all her income has gone to savings/investments.

                            I am afraid too that I'm just burying my head in the sand, wanting to keep things as they are, not recognizing that my family is changing, maybe moving on while I'm still here stuck in the happiness of the past.

                            Any helpful insights? Have you experienced this before?
                            OP, just got to say I really appreciate this honest, searching post. As a physician spouse close to 40, with kids around 6-12, I feel the struggle! I don't have the answers for sure but keep wrestling with it. Thanks for sharing.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Wife unhappy with work? Wife quitting will significantly delay FI. Wife changing jobs shouldn't that much. It will keep her doing what she trained to do, & making more money than zero.

                              House isn't nice enough? If house size isn't an issue, remodel/renovate/upgrade could be the answer. Add some outdoor stuff, especially with aging children. New bathroom stuff with fancy heat lamps. New stove, sink. Keep things fresh.

                              Aging children want to do their own thing? Sure, a part time job is productive, keeps them occupied, while typically being a safe place.

                              Feeling too secure financially? Mail cash in envelope to:
                              Cubicle
                              0 Degrees Place Frozen Tundra Winter ************************, NJ​​​​​
                              $1 saved = >$1 earned. ✓

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by braindoc View Post
                                I know this is a personal finance forum, but I recommend taking some time to really think about what your definition of success really is. Does being successful mean having a certain net worth or amount in your brokerage? Personally, I like this quote by Emerson :

                                "What is success? To laugh often and much; to win the respect of intelligent people and the affection of children; to earn the appreciation of honest critics and endure the betrayal of false friends; to appreciate the beauty; to find the best in others; to leave the world a bit better, whether by a healthy child, a garden patch Or a redeemed social condition; to know even one life has breathed easier because you have lived. This is to have succeeded!"

                                By that definition alone you are already extraordinarily successful...not even considering your high net worth.
                                Wow! Awesomeness!

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X