EM MD Income

[canadianoutlaw]

With end of residency getting closer every day, I'm trying to get a sense for the average salaries/income of EM docs for both academics and private practice before the job market heats up. I appreciate this can be a hard question to answer as a lot of factors come into play. My question is: what does the WCI community feel are the best references to learn about this sort of thing?

[VagabondMD]

Networking (word-of-mouth) with colleagues who have recently taken their first jobs and those from your program who have been out of training for a few years. You will also want to compare notes with people in your residency class who are starting their job search with the understanding that you will likely be competing with some of them for the same job (which might limit discussion).

[The White Coat Investor]

And look at a salary survey, such as the Daniel Sterns Survey or the MGMA survey.

 

Not at home right now with my latest copy of the DS survey, but here's a link to some data from the old ones:

https://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/daniel-stern-salary-survey.1071457/

[adventure]

canadianoutlaw wrote:

My question is: what does the WCI community feel are the best references to learn about this sort of thing?

Click to expand...

Ask people who do it for a job. Just ask.

MGMA, etc as mentioned above

Many states (CT, GA, UT, MI, etc) have state salaries posted publicly online. Check those. It'll at least show you what ED docs make if they work for the university (some work for a company that the university hires, so YMMV, but it's worth a look).

(Thanks for moderating this place too, btw!)

[SValleyMD]

I think just throwing out numbers with some background info (rural, shifts per month) from prospective jobs will get you a fair amount of feedback on this site.

[EDDOCMOM]

I'm ED and I'll give you numbers.  I work in a rural tertiary center with no ED residency but we teach surgical, Peds and FP residents.  I make >$400,000 per year working 15+ shifts per month (this year looking to crack the $500,000 line with picking up extra nights and weekends).  I think this is on the higher end. The more I work, the more I make (bonus $$ for picking up extra shifts, +differential for working nights).  I make more than Locums when you figure in the benefits package. A lot of my residency classmates make closer to $300,000. ED is typically paid hourly but this can vary.

[GXA]

1. Work as hard as you want.

2. Live where you want.

3. Make what you want.

You can generally select two of these three.

For most I know in the Midwest, full time runs from about 1400-1800 hours a year, and pay from about 300,000-500,000.  I do know a few outliers making well above this due to some unusual circumstances.

These are for community jobs.

[The White Coat Investor]

All right, on my own computer now. Here's the 2017 Medscape EM salary survey:

http://www.medscape.com/slideshow/compensation-2017-emergency-medicine-6008568

It says the average is $339K. $387K self-employed, $314K employed.

I've always felt the Medscape data was a little on the low side. A survey I participate in every year is the Daniel Sterns. They send me a copy every year, but it probably isn't fair to them to share it publicly. But I think it's fine to cite a little data from it. The latest copy I have is 2015 (which I think is the one that comes out in 2016)

Overall, the 50th percentile was $320K, 10th percentile at $223K, 90th percentile is $460K. Employees are on the low end, partners on the high end, independent contractors somewhere in the middle. The partner 90th percentile is $510K. I do know emergency docs making that, but they're generally working pretty hard. EM is a pretty straightforward trade your time for money kind of specialty, so if you find a place paying a decent hourly rate and you put in enough hours (especially at night) you can earn like a surgeon.

[canadianoutlaw]

Thanks for the input everyone, this is a very helpful starting point!

[MPMD]

The White Coat Investor wrote:

All right, on my own computer now. Here’s the 2017 Medscape EM salary survey:

http://www.medscape.com/slideshow/compensation-2017-emergency-medicine-6008568

It says the average is $339K. $387K self-employed, $314K employed.

I’ve always felt the Medscape data was a little on the low side. A survey I participate in every year is the Daniel Sterns. They send me a copy every year, but it probably isn’t fair to them to share it publicly. But I think it’s fine to cite a little data from it. The latest copy I have is 2015 (which I think is the one that comes out in 2016)

Overall, the 50th percentile was $320K, 10th percentile at $223K, 90th percentile is $460K. Employees are on the low end, partners on the high end, independent contractors somewhere in the middle. The partner 90th percentile is $510K. I do know emergency docs making that, but they’re generally working pretty hard. EM is a pretty straightforward trade your time for money kind of specialty, so if you find a place paying a decent hourly rate and you put in enough hours (especially at night) you can earn like a surgeon.

Click to expand...

This seems about as accurate to me as anything.

Would be curious if Medscape is lumping academics in w/ private practice.

Academic base salary is $190-250k usually. Bonuses variable.

Highest paid ED doc I know personally is in the $415k range, working hard, small city, small demo group.

[White.Beard.Doc]

In the northeast, salaries are lower.  An academic, full time ED job at a prestigious University in Manhattan can pay from 220k to around 290k.  Your bedside clinical hours will be less, but you will have teaching and research responsibilities.  The community jobs in the NYC area pay from the low to the mid 300's.

If you go elsewhere in the country, 350k to 450k jobs are not unusual.  But there are many differences in the offers that make comparison apples to oranges, unless you know how to value each aspect of the offer.  Is there paid time off included, how much do they contribute to your pension, etc.?

If money is very important to you, say you want to pay off student loans in a year or two, you can work like a dog, do high paid locums, and make 600k plus travel and lodging expenses.  A friend of mine worked crazy locum hours all over the country his first 18 months after residency and paid off all of his student loans.  Now he has the lower stress academic job in NYC and bought a nice brownstone townhouse with a hefty down payment.

[EM_INDY]

I agree with some of the numbers other people have been saying. Among my classmates who took community jobs most were >$400,000 (although my classmates were particularly attracted to high paying jobs in relatively LCOL areas). I have multiple former classmates making >$500,000/yr and one in the 700's (although he works an insane amount of shifts and a ton of nights).