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  • #31
    Originally posted by FIREshrink View Post

    It is a large part of the problem, in addition both systems are the result of government subsidies which blind the consumer to the true cost of the service. Finally health care, higher Ed, and child care demonstrate the true devaluation of the dollar over the last two generations, as they are primarily labor-driven industries and therefore can't be outsourced to sweatshops in China and Vietnam and the destruction of the dollar's value can't be obfuscated.
    Lolz.

    Saying physician salaries are a large part of the problem loses any and all credibility you may have in this discussion.

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    • #32
      Never mind. Free community college just got cut from spending bill. We will invest in missiles, banks, import many educated from all over the world and good chunk of population will continue as is. Not good for the future.

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      • #33
        WOW-Anyone attend CUNY WAY BACK AT ZERO TUITION!!!!

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        • #34
          Originally posted by Kamban View Post
          2. Some want small schools, liberal arts, religious, private. All those cost money. Much, much more money.
          Jeez, nothing here suggested the earnings potential of an ABET accredited engineering major at a flagship public university or even an accounting major at a state school. “Expensive college plus poor prospective earnings? Where do I sign up?”

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          • #35
            My husband went to his state school and majored in computer science.

            This is the way, people. Financially, I have been the drag.

            But in the flip side, I cannot and do not want to do what he does - code all day. And then, to relax, he codes more at night.

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            • #36
              Originally posted by Lordosis View Post

              As of right now that is my plan.

              Op who knows. Maybe there will be a revolution in tuition in the next decade. I doubt it but maybe.
              Some disruptive force will smash this.

              Huge opportunity!

              Uber type deal.

              Just not exactly sure what/ when / how / where.

              Imagine the company.

              It could “train” very bright & motivated students to
              1. destroy MCAT (or other standardized test)
              2. get into good medical school / grad school
              3. finish early (3 years)
              4. cost 10k per year

              Imagine a money back guarantee?

              For 30k you skip the bs college experience, skip the leftist indoctrination training classes, skip the >200k bill, skip the silly beer pong type garbage.

              The money-back guarantee motivates the heck out of the company to ensure they crush the entrance exams for STEM.

              Entrance to the school 100% merit based. Test scores.

              something like this.
              Last edited by Tangler; 10-28-2021, 07:03 AM.

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              • #37
                Originally posted by CordMcNally View Post
                You can certainly pay that much for college now if you wanted to. You’d have to run a cost vs. benefit scenario to see if it’s worth it. There’s not too many reasons that would make me think it would be worth it.
                Yes. Many (very many) people would be better off learning a needed trade (Electrician, HVAC repair, Plumbing) than going to an expensive college and getting a 4 year degree that does not help them get a job.

                You cannot afford to get a degree in something that pays 40k per year (frequently in a job you hate) and costs 400k (currently with fees, room and board, food).

                I fish with a guy who is an electrician. He loves it. He is a huge union guy (has a big pension) and he does important work that matters.

                Shortage of people like him.

                Says it takes two years to become an electrician. According to what I think he said (when we were catching black sea bass) Union pays for the cost of training you and then you start on year three at around 20-22 years old making around 65k per year.

                Not bad. No wonder he loves his union! Hard to argue with that, and I am not a fan of unions.

                (His daughter on the other hand, got a degree in "communications" and she lives in his basement and is now going to get her masters.......he asked me: "Tangler, you went through a lot of school...........do you thing the ROI is always there?" I had to honestly answer: Nope.)

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by Tangler View Post

                  Yes. Many (very many) people would be better off learning a needed trade (Electrician, HVAC repair, Plumbing) than going to an expensive college and getting a 4 year degree that does not help them get a job.

                  You cannot afford to get a degree in something that pays 40k per year (frequently in a job you hate) and costs 400k (currently with fees, room and board, food).

                  I fish with a guy who is an electrician. He loves it. He is a huge union guy (has a big pension) and he does important work that matters.

                  Shortage of people like him.

                  Says it takes two years to become an electrician. According to what I think he said (when we were catching black sea bass) Union pays for the cost of training you and then you start on year three at around 20-22 years old making around 65k per year.

                  Not bad. No wonder he loves his union! Hard to argue with that, and I am not a fan of unions.

                  (His daughter on the other hand, got a degree in "communications" and she lives in his basement and is now going to get her masters.......he asked me: "Tangler, you went through a lot of school...........do you thing the ROI is always there?" I had to honestly answer: Nope.)
                  They are talking about decreasing the minimum age for truck drivers to 18 due to the current shortage. Truck drivers can make over $100k fairly easily. Huge shortage and greatly needed.

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Anne View Post

                    They are talking about decreasing the minimum age for truck drivers to 18 due to the current shortage. Truck drivers can make over $100k fairly easily. Huge shortage and greatly needed.
                    I find it interesting that med students and other physicians talk about AI like its going to replace physicians in the next few years and yet truck drivers are still kickin' and, last i checked, the airplanes i'm in still have pilots in them

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Turf Doc View Post

                      I find it interesting that med students and other physicians talk about AI like its going to replace physicians in the next few years and yet truck drivers are still kickin' and, last i checked, the airplanes i'm in still have pilots in them
                      Automated trucks are coming but likely there will still be someone in the truck working in a supply chain logistics role, trouble shooting issues, etc. That is the current prediction at least.

                      AI can do a lot but the human interaction piece is still needed. I think AI will augment medicine and many other industries.

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                      • #41
                        I didnt make it through the second page but universities admissions are on year 2 of a large decline. Its not that popular right now, if they keep raising costs, it will be worse.

                        I am hopeful for a break in the decades long paradigm for at least a little bit.

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Turf Doc View Post

                          I find it interesting that med students and other physicians talk about AI like its going to replace physicians in the next few years and yet truck drivers are still kickin' and, last i checked, the airplanes i'm in still have pilots in them
                          It is coming, but the time frame is not as optimistic as some seem to believe. Thirty years ago the main communication was phone and writing letters and mailing them. Now it is all text and email. I can't remember the last time I wrote a letter ( other than a couple of lines on a birthday card).

                          Drone planes with remote pilots are doing a significant amount of bombings in war. Planes can take off, land and fly by themselves but the FAA has not allowed it due to public perception should a disaster occur. Truck drivers will be there for the next 5-10 years in current numbers but I won't bet on it being the same in 30 years. And thirty years is not too long. Time whizzes by.

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Kamban View Post

                            It is coming, but the time frame is not as optimistic as some seem to believe. Thirty years ago the main communication was phone and writing letters and mailing them. Now it is all text and email. I can't remember the last time I wrote a letter ( other than a couple of lines on a birthday card).

                            Drone planes with remote pilots are doing a significant amount of bombings in war. Planes can take off, land and fly by themselves but the FAA has not allowed it due to public perception should a disaster occur. Truck drivers will be there for the next 5-10 years in current numbers but I won't bet on it being the same in 30 years. And thirty years is not too long. Time whizzes by.
                            Yeah, most of the examples would work, except planes, but that isnt ai by any stretch as far as i know (which is near 0 so Himalayan of pink salt here) as they can run themselves likely better than people.

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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Hank View Post

                              Jeez, nothing here suggested the earnings potential of an ABET accredited engineering major at a flagship public university or even an accounting major at a state school. “Expensive college plus poor prospective earnings? Where do I sign up?”
                              The reality is that a significant amount of students who join a college are just not educated / trained / suitable for any rigorous course like medicine, engineering, law, accounting etc. That is why they choose the soft subjects that allow them to graduate but yet end with a low paying job.

                              And an engineer from a flagship state can build bridges and one from MIT can help land a rover on Mars. But both are qualified and can earn a substantial income. But a sociology major from anywhere is unlikely to earn more than a minimum wage. I am a strong believer in tying college loans to they type of subject you choose. Choose computer science or engineering - you get loans with low rates. Choose one of the soft, useless subjects - the rates are much higher and the loan is harder to get since you are likely to default.

                              Not everyone needs a college degree. And making it free with make it lose its value.
                              Last edited by Kamban; 10-28-2021, 09:16 AM.

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                              • #45
                                As I read thru this post, I keep thinking, education and weddings.... spend to your hearts content. Cost vs. value.... a discussion that never ends.

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