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  • #31
    Originally posted by RheumMD View Post

    Thanks. My two sister in laws live down the street and they each have two kids so we are kind of a carpool gang these days. That's really the only reason for a bigger car. AWD certainly not 100% necessary, but there are definitely days it is a necessity as they don't plow streets here and I cannot get anywhere in my FWD Civic. Appreciate everyone's responses, I'm gonna start looking more into the $20-25k SUV range, used cars are just really tough to find these days.
    Yeah you are speaking minivan language. The practicality will make up for the times you use it to commute.

    Snow tires are more important than AWD

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    • #32
      Sounds like you are open to feedback unlike some of the other posters here that come in and want positive reinforcement that spending beyond their means is okay.

      Fresh attending with 325k in student loans. If you follow WCI you should know the core commandment is to live like a resident for a few years, slowly grow in to your income and then enjoy the good life after 3-5 years.

      Where is your income going if you’re just planning to make the minimum payments? How much are you planning to put away towards building your wealth? You have some home equity but you’re still nearly -200k in the hole right now. The math on the low interest rate only makes sense if you’re straight up investing that money instead of knocking out the loans.

      I wouldn’t count on partnership income, either. A lot can happen between now and then. From stringing you along to selling out to private equity, nothing is guaranteed. You’re also going to have to buy in to the practice and pay that back so it’s unlikely you’re going to be cash flowing significantly more than you are now, at least for a year or two after partnership.

      My advice is to but a reliable, used car that meets your needs. Three rows, AWD, shouldn’t cost you more than 15-20k. Skip the 50-60k Tesla until you can actually afford it, not when it’s at the expense of student loans or jump starting your wealth building.

      edit: Just jumped on Autotrader and found a whole bunch of Toyota Highlander with three rows and AWD under 100k miles all under 20k. A car like that is likely good for 100k more. No excuse for spending way above that if utility is your primary goal.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by VentAlarm View Post

        And, as above, I get that the Tesla is cool, but as the dad of three kids, I can tell you that the cool days are behind you. Get something practical. Heck, buy a pilot or odyssey with 100k miles on it, then get a model S as a toy in a couple years if you want. With y’all’s income, it’s not inappropriate to buy a 50k toy when the loans are paid off.

        My neighbors had their third kid a couple months ago. The husband texted me that his wife told him “leave and come back with a minivan. I don’t care what it looks like, just go get it today.”
        Ha, this was me. I had my third kid a couple months ago. I had the baby on a Sunday and was sitting in Carmax on Wednesday. It would have sent my husband, but I had done all the financials online. I won't say it was a great deal given the used car market right now (close to $30K for a 2018 model with 24,000 miles), but we really like our Chrysler Pacifica.

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        • #34
          The choice isn’t loan or the car.
          The choice is loan or investment.

          Just a note about the carpooling. Kids and carpooling can put a ton of wear and tear on the interior. All your desires for a “cool car” logically lead to utility as a priority. One of the advantages of sticking with two seats might be someone else driving. Just saying. CRV might suffice for your needs.

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          • #35

            Kids and carpooling:
            Honda-Odyssey, Passport, Pilot
            Protect your seats/keep barf bags handy/stow gear in rear

            After your carpooling days:
            Acura MDX/RDX

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            • #36
              Originally posted by Lordosis View Post

              Yeah you are speaking minivan language. The practicality will make up for the times you use it to commute.

              Snow tires are more important than AWD
              I can't recommend snow tires enough. They are like magic! Our first two years back in Minnesota we didn't have them on our Prius. Put them on for the 3rd winter and I swear it was like having AWD. When we bought our 2016 Dodge Caravan, I went about 2 weeks with the factory tires before getting a set for that car too.

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              • #37
                500k in loans, i make less than that in income, i still bought a model y, no ragrats

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                • #38
                  Seems like a good student loan to income ratio, why 10-15 years payoff? Yeah good interest rate, but that kind of presumes you're doing something better with the money. What's your cashflow look like if you were going to pay those off in 5 years? Can you still meet all your goals OTHER than buying a sweet tesla?

                  Also think you should pay straight cash for it if you're going to get it. Why should an attending have a car loan?

                  Seems to me like almost no individual decision will sink you, just be careful that it's not the beginning of a bunch of other expensive decisions

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Turf Doc View Post
                    Also think you should pay straight cash for it if you're going to get it. Why should an attending have a car loan?
                    Car loans are cheap money with low interest rates. As long as you’re investing the difference and making more than the loan interest, it can make sense.

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Nysoz View Post

                      Car loans are cheap money with low interest rates. As long as you’re investing the difference and making more than the loan interest, it can make sense.
                      Compound requirements. Leveraging investments multiples losses as well as gains.
                      Past performance ......blah, blah, blah.
                      It can make sense. Car loans only make sense if you can afford to pay it off and choose not to.

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                      • #41
                        Car loans are cheap money with low interest rates. As long as you’re investing the difference and making more than the loan interest, it can make sense.

                        Because borrowing money to buy a depreciating consumer good is not an investment. 5 year treasuries pay .73% right now, which is considered a guaranteed return, not a speculative stock market return. because every one knows that can go up or down. So if you can borrow for less than .73% for 5 years you are probably winning the interest game. Otherwise you are speculating that your returns will be higher. The other issue is that many people , just seem to purchase more car when they are not paying cash.

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                        • #42
                          We love our Toyota Highlander. Right now used cars are expensive, I'd look certified pre-owned but be prepared to buy new.

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                          • #43
                            Tesla is great but still an expense and will never be a bargain but can be a good value relative to the fun factor and driving experience. Keep in mind the range estimates on the Y are some of the most optimistic since it’s bigger and so highway travel above 70mph gets way less than stated range probably about 240 miles and since you don’t want to arrive with 5% battery plan on 200 miles of real world USABLE range between destinations. Additionally the extra seats are so small they won’t work for all but the smallest children. That said, it seats 4 comfortably and is the most fun car out of its class. I test drove the whole group from Range Rover, Acura, BMW, Mercedes, and Honda CRV hybrid. It was the clear winner.

                            If you live in a climate that gets hot budget $1k extra for a high quality ceramic tint as all the glass inside is beautiful but makes it a functional greenhouse in the summer.

                            For charging, check and see if the hospital has free charging. All 4 that I work at do and it makes a huge difference in operating cost especially with a long commute. So I only need to supercharge on long road trips otherwise all charging is covered by hospital.

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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Random1 View Post
                              Car loans are cheap money with low interest rates. As long as you’re investing the difference and making more than the loan interest, it can make sense.

                              Because borrowing money to buy a depreciating consumer good is not an investment. 5 year treasuries pay .73% right now, which is considered a guaranteed return, not a speculative stock market return. because every one knows that can go up or down. So if you can borrow for less than .73% for 5 years you are probably winning the interest game. Otherwise you are speculating that your returns will be higher. The other issue is that many people , just seem to purchase more car when they are not paying cash.
                              The problem is that tacking a new car loan onto 300k in student loans on a new attending salary with justification that they'll pay off once partner is a slippery slope.

                              I would once again like to ask OP, where is his income going if not to loans? Is it going straight to a taxable or retirement account? If it's just being spent upgrading lifestyle then it's not going to end well.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Random1 View Post

                                Because borrowing money to buy a depreciating consumer good is not an investment. 5 year treasuries pay .73% right now, which is considered a guaranteed return, not a speculative stock market return. because every one knows that can go up or down. So if you can borrow for less than .73% for 5 years you are probably winning the interest game. Otherwise you are speculating that your returns will be higher. The other issue is that many people , just seem to purchase more car when they are not paying cash.
                                So paying cash for the same depreciating consumer good is that much better? No matter what, you're paying the same amount of money into the car principle. Either up front or over time. Paying over time, you pay a low interest rate which gives you extra flexibility of paying down other higher interest you may have or to invest.

                                Sure, investing in anything is speculating. Choosing to pay cash is speculating in a sense. Even though past performance and such, historically over a long time frame, investing wins over low interest debt. VTI returns 8.8% since inception (2001), 14.7% for the past 10 years, 44.3% the past year.

                                The key is buying a reasonable car for your budget. Save 20% towards retirement and spend the rest on whatever you want. That may be vacations, a doctor house, fancy food, paying down loans, investing, or a fancy car. Loans/mortgages don't give you free range to buy whatever you want, just options and liquidity if used appropriately.

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