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  • #61
    Originally posted by Razzman View Post
    Judging from the ad hominem attacks it’s clear that the bulk of players on this thread drive in the left lane, but that’s fine.
    Whatever happened to “My body, my choice”? Had she been pregnant and chose to abort her baby, I’m guessing there’d be a consensus thumbs up here. It’s disturbing to see her demeaned and insulted for her choice. You are absolutely entitled to let her go, but not disparage her. It used to be, in a free society, one could make choices and live with the consequences without being pilloried. She is essentially at zero risk of dying from COVID, and the role of asymptomatic carriers as vectors is far from established science. In fact, if you believe the data coming out of China, which I agree may be suspect, the opposite may be true.
    For the record I got the jab as I am in a risk group. No issue there, I am not an anti vaxxer. but I would counsel woman of child bearing age as to the issues. I personally know 2 woman who work with me in surgery that were vaccinated and miscarried. Try throwing the mandated narrative at them….they are devastated. I spend way too much time in the surgeons lounge between cases, and hear the GYN guys comparing notes on the uptick in miscarriages. There are plenty of people far brighter than anybody on this forum, who have raised concerns as to the safety of this vaccine and it’s anti-placental potential. They have all been actively censored by the government-media complex. Telling…

    So, I’ll bow out now, but would encourage all of you to take off your TDS glasses for a minute and look at the data, use a non censored site, and then decide if you’ll push for the vaccine for your daughter or a wife hoping for kids.
    I think I may have posted this on another thread, can’t remember.
    My son’s best friend from growing up and his wife were anti-vaxxers (they live not far from me). 2 daughters, 11 and 9. She was 5 mos pregnant with their son when they both got COVID (I pray he didn’t give it to her, haven’t wanted to ask Matt yet). He got well. Her baby died first, then she died the next morning. Still having trouble imagining what Travis and his motherless daughters are going through right now and will be for the rest of their lives.

    I have no sympathy for anyone who refuses to get the vaccine and expects to be around the rest of the population. If they want to refuse and isolate, no problem, their body, their choice. But potentially exposing other people to a life-threatening condition just because of your beliefs? Nobody should have the right to do that.
    Our passion is protecting clients and others from predatory and ignorant advisors. Fox & Co CPAs, Fox & Co Wealth Mgmt. 270-247-6087

    Comment


    • #62
      Originally posted by ObgynMD View Post

      I would liken it to not being comfortable keeping a nanny who decided to start smoking. Her body, her choice, but still not aligned with my values.

      One can respect the individual but disagree if they are a good fit to help raise your kids.
      Actually I wouldn’t allow a smoker to
      nanny my children either.

      Comment


      • #63
        Originally posted by TheDangerZone View Post

        Are you getting your news from facebook friends? See below for a thorough debunking of this claim.

        https://www.factcheck.org/2021/07/cd...ing-pregnancy/
        Factcheck…really? They are bankrolled by the Annenberg Foundation. Nuff said.
        Anyway, NEJM is not paywalled, so take a peak at figure 4 and the footnotes and tell me, in your own words, where I am wrong.

        Comment


        • #64
          Originally posted by jfoxcpacfp View Post
          My son’s best friend from growing up and his wife were anti-vaxxers (they live not far from me). 2 daughters, 11 and 9. She was 5 mos pregnant with their son when they both got COVID (I pray he didn’t give it to her, haven’t wanted to ask Matt yet). He got well. Her baby died first, then she died the next morning. Still having trouble imagining what Travis and his motherless daughters are going through right now and will be for the rest of their lives.
          That is a horrendous story. Unfortunately, these stories do nothing to change anti-vaxxers minds though. My wife's aunt passed away from COVID in December. My FIL (the aunt's twin brother) and MIL got it at the same time, but did ok. The aunt passing away from COVID has done literally nothing to convince my MIL/FIL, BIL and his family, and SIL and her family to get the vaccine. The BIL is the only one to even have a somewhat "reasonable" conversation about this.

          Anti-vaxxers have an irrational and likely delusional underestimation of the true risk of COVID and an irrational and likely delusional overestimation of the true risk of the vaccine. Thus, they think risk of the vaccine is greater than COVID itself.

          Comment


          • #65
            Originally posted by ObgynMD View Post

            I would liken it to not being comfortable keeping a nanny who decided to start smoking. Her body, her choice, but still not aligned with my values.

            One can respect the individual but disagree if they are a good fit to help raise your kids.
            Agree 100%. Respect and disagree, and move on.

            Comment


            • #66
              Originally posted by Razzman View Post

              Agree 100%. Respect and disagree, and move on.
              Move on, sure. Respect. Nope.

              Comment


              • #67
                Originally posted by RJB View Post

                No contract. We actually pay her in cash.

                We sent her this.

                Karlee, while it is certainly your decision not to vaccinated for COVID-19, we unfortunately cannot allow you to continue being a nanny for our girls in our home. This is not a decision we came to lightly.

                As you know I am a pulmonary and critical care physician, if you are open to having a discussion with me about the vaccine, I’d like to address your concerns about the vaccine and make sure you are making your decision based on a solid foundation of knowledge.

                We would very much like for you to get the vaccine and continue caring for our girls.


                She responded with

                I’m sorry to see our relationship end like this because of my personal beliefs and my personal decision to not get the COVID-19 vaccination. Since you feel so strongly about me not being around the children unvaccinated, I will consider my termination effectively immediately.

                We were going to let her finish out July.


                Why give your kids any more exposure to this fool? Immediately means it's over (and good riddance).

                Comment


                • #68
                  Originally posted by RJB View Post

                  Move on, sure. Respect. Nope.
                  I don’t think disrespect will help anyone. You can’t attack someone into changing their mind. Love and respect are important to give one another because we are all human. Without that foundation, there is no progress, just ad hominem attacks which cause more harm than good.

                  I have been able to change the minds of a few of my patients who have gotten vaccinated partially because of me. If I disrespected them, that would not be possible.

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Originally posted by ObgynMD View Post

                    I don’t think disrespect will help anyone. You can’t attack someone into changing their mind. Love and respect are important to give one another because we are all human. Without that foundation, there is no progress, just ad hominem attacks which cause more harm than good.

                    I have been able to change the minds of a few of my patients who have gotten vaccinated partially because of me. If I disrespected them, that would not be possible.
                    I too have changed a few minds and of course I am less abrasive during the doctor patient encounter But in this situation Im a father and a husband and a son.

                    I think maybe I hold the word respect to a higher standard. I can have a productive and fruitful conversation with a patient without respecting their decision. I can still treat another human being with dignity and the respect they deserve as a person without respecting a behavior or a decision.

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      Originally posted by RJB View Post

                      No contract. We actually pay her in cash.

                      We sent her this.

                      Karlee, while it is certainly your decision not to vaccinated for COVID-19, we unfortunately cannot allow you to continue being a nanny for our girls in our home. This is not a decision we came to lightly.

                      As you know I am a pulmonary and critical care physician, if you are open to having a discussion with me about the vaccine, I’d like to address your concerns about the vaccine and make sure you are making your decision based on a solid foundation of knowledge.

                      We would very much like for you to get the vaccine and continue caring for our girls.


                      She responded with

                      I’m sorry to see our relationship end like this because of my personal beliefs and my personal decision to not get the COVID-19 vaccination. Since you feel so strongly about me not being around the children unvaccinated, I will consider my termination effectively immediately.

                      We were going to let her finish out July.


                      Your response to her was classy and professional. Bravo.

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Originally posted by JWeb View Post

                        That is a horrendous story. Unfortunately, these stories do nothing to change anti-vaxxers minds though. My wife's aunt passed away from COVID in December. My FIL (the aunt's twin brother) and MIL got it at the same time, but did ok. The aunt passing away from COVID has done literally nothing to convince my MIL/FIL, BIL and his family, and SIL and her family to get the vaccine. The BIL is the only one to even have a somewhat "reasonable" conversation about this.

                        Anti-vaxxers have an irrational and likely delusional underestimation of the true risk of COVID and an irrational and likely delusional overestimation of the true risk of the vaccine. Thus, they think risk of the vaccine is greater than COVID itself.
                        How can anyone who just lost a twin to COVID think the vaccine has a higher risk than the vaccine? What - spontaneous combustion when the needle goes in? How did your wife escape this crowd?
                        Our passion is protecting clients and others from predatory and ignorant advisors. Fox & Co CPAs, Fox & Co Wealth Mgmt. 270-247-6087

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          Originally posted by Razzman View Post
                          Judging from the ad hominem attacks it’s clear that the bulk of players on this thread drive in the left lane, but that’s fine.
                          Whatever happened to “My body, my choice”? Had she been pregnant and chose to abort her baby, I’m guessing there’d be a consensus thumbs up here. It’s disturbing to see her demeaned and insulted for her choice. You are absolutely entitled to let her go, but not disparage her. It used to be, in a free society, one could make choices and live with the consequences without being pilloried. She is essentially at zero risk of dying from COVID, and the role of asymptomatic carriers as vectors is far from established science. In fact, if you believe the data coming out of China, which I agree may be suspect, the opposite may be true.
                          For the record I got the jab as I am in a risk group. No issue there, I am not an anti vaxxer. but I would counsel woman of child bearing age as to the issues. I personally know 2 woman who work with me in surgery that were vaccinated and miscarried. Try throwing the mandated narrative at them….they are devastated. I spend way too much time in the surgeons lounge between cases, and hear the GYN guys comparing notes on the uptick in miscarriages. There are plenty of people far brighter than anybody on this forum, who have raised concerns as to the safety of this vaccine and it’s anti-placental potential. They have all been actively censored by the government-media complex. Telling…

                          So, I’ll bow out now, but would encourage all of you to take off your TDS glasses for a minute and look at the data, use a non censored site, and then decide if you’ll push for the vaccine for your daughter or a wife hoping for kids.




                          Words, words,.words - you claimed against all evidence that the vaccines induced a SAB rate of 82% which is either a gross misreading of the data based on ignorance or a gross misrepresentation of the data based on an agenda, and either way you are way out of your depth here.

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            I still think we are getting trolled. Nothing in the posts make any sense to an educated person let alone a forum of educated physicians.

                            Comment


                            • #74
                              Preliminary Findings of mRNA Covid-19 Vaccine Safety in Pregnant Persons (nejm)

                              I find the implication that this a left leaning forum amusing. I find it to be more right leaning but I guess the view may depend on where you are.

                              Regarding the nanny clearly you made the right call.

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                Originally posted by jfoxcpacfp View Post

                                I think I may have posted this on another thread, can’t remember.
                                My son’s best friend from growing up and his wife were anti-vaxxers (they live not far from me). 2 daughters, 11 and 9. She was 5 mos pregnant with their son when they both got COVID (I pray he didn’t give it to her, haven’t wanted to ask Matt yet). He got well. Her baby died first, then she died the next morning. Still having trouble imagining what Travis and his motherless daughters are going through right now and will be for the rest of their lives.

                                I have no sympathy for anyone who refuses to get the vaccine and expects to be around the rest of the population. If they want to refuse and isolate, no problem, their body, their choice. But potentially exposing other people to a life-threatening condition just because of your beliefs? Nobody should have the right to do that.
                                My wife had to manage 2 trimester patients on vent. Both survived. Stressful all around. All quiet on the western front right now but sounds like:
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