Medical Discussion of Coronavirus

[MaxPower]

Your thoughts about booster (shot #3) for kids?

My kids have had two Pfizer shots. I plan to boost them by fall but have been holding out for more variant specific boosters. Early data suggested omicron specific boosters weren't more effective. Then recently Moderns says their modified booster was better at producing antibodies, but of course it's cellular immunity I really care about, not humoral - it's only worth getting a booster if it measurably decreases the risk of a serious outcome. And there's the problem of Moderna being a higher dose, with higher rates (albeit still very low) of post vaccine myocarditis than Pfizer.

If an omicron or other variant vaccine isn't tested by early summer it won't be approved by fall.

So: by fall, would you do 1. Pfizer #3; 2. Moderna modified if available; 3. Moderna original; 4. None at all/wait for different vaccine?

Kids 12-17, no known risk factors, both have gotten two shot Pfizer.

My three kids all had Pfizer x 2, then got Covid (omicron I’m assuming) about 5 months (oldest 2) and ~1 month (youngest, who wasn’t eligible for the vaccine as early as the other 2) after their second vaccines. Only oldest had symptoms, and they were extremely mild and only lasted about 2 days. Barring some new evidence, I don’t plan on having them get a booster.

[gap55u]

PCP here. Clinics recently dropped mask mandates- now optional. I stopped wearing a mask and promptly got my first URI in 2 years. . We are seeing an uptick in Covid cases locally.

What are docs deciding re 2nd booster? I haven’t done it because data seemed poor and I’m not particularly high risk. I’ve had 3 Pfizer’s. My next is definitely a moderna when/if I decide to get one.

[CordMcNally]

It seems like the push for additional boosters have really fallen off a cliff these days. I also think variant specific boosters produced fast enough to actually be effective are a pipe dream. It seems most people have come to realize this is something we’re going to live with as variants become seemingly more mild.

[Tim]

Government serves a function. Most lump research and development into one bucket. From a business perspective, the government funded research was absolutely needed. Development is bringing a product to market. Government is failing miserably, because they don’t, can’t and should not be in business.
Ask one question: who is willing to pay for a booster and how much?

https://journals.plos.org/ploscompbiol/article?id=10.1371/journal.pcbi.1002712

Ten simple rules for commercializing research results into market acceptance.

No takers for bringing an absolutely brilliant and effective product to consumers. Trying to make boosters a business has no basis yet from a science or business perspective. Benefits don’t justify the expenses. It’s a losing business plan.

• Rule 10: Customers Are The Ultimate Peer Review

Without government funding this business development, bankrupt! Revenue forecast?

[zlandar]

The NEMJ article on the 2nd booster is lukewarm. I'm holding off until there is a stronger data to get another booster.

Masks are futile against omnicron. If the Chinese can't keep it from spreading despite their draconian shutdowns no one can. I don't wear one unless I'm inside the hospital or in a location that mandates it.

[fatlittlepig]

My three kids all had Pfizer x 2, then got Covid (omicron I’m assuming) about 5 months (oldest 2) and ~1 month (youngest, who wasn’t eligible for the vaccine as early as the other 2) after their second vaccines. Only oldest had symptoms, and they were extremely mild and only lasted about 2 days. Barring some new evidence, I don’t plan on having them get a booster.

yes, boosting a population at baseline minimal risk, to provide transient protection against a virus that they have already contracted seems quite unnecessary. at the very least I would wait for a better booster.

[Kamban]

I don't really care what the daily new cases are, either here or in Shanghai or in Timbuktu. What I am really interested in are the hospitalization rate, ICU admission rate and the death rate. These are the truly important numbers.

I have specifically avoided quoting the rag paper that some here love to parade. It loves to overdramatize things since stating the relevant things might not serve its agenda.. So here is the data from the CDC website April 6-13th

Hospitalization
1,446
Current 7-Day Average

Deaths
409
Current 7-Day Average*
486
Prior 7-Day Average
-15.7%
Change in 7-Day Average Since Prior Week


So in a country of 330M, do we have to make a huge fuss about 1446 COVID hospitalization and 409 deaths. Unfortunately they do not report the vaccination status or the age of those hospitalized and those who died but if I have to guess, a significant number of those hospitalizations and deaths will be in the unvaccinated, elderly, having comorbid conditions or a combination of the three.

I do not think the current data warrants a 4th booster dose. If anything, vaccinating the unvaccinated would give bigger bang for the buck.

[CordMcNally]

So in a country of 330M, do we have to make a huge fuss about 1446 COVID hospitalization and 409 deaths. Unfortunately they do not report the vaccination status or the age of those hospitalized and those who died but if I have to guess, a significant number of those hospitalizations and deaths will be in the unvaccinated, elderly, having comorbid conditions or a combination of the three.

I do not think the current data warrants a 4th booster dose. If anything, vaccinating the unvaccinated would give bigger bang for the buck.

In my limited (one hospital system) experience, I would wager the majority of hospitalizations and deaths are in the vaccinated. These same people almost universally are pretty sick and fragile at baseline. It's been a long time since I've heard of a healthy person (even the young morbidly obese 'healthy' people) who have been sick enough for hospitalization or who have died.

[fatlittlepig]

Is anyone here willing to admit to having covid fatigue and now total covid indifference? Vaccinate, accept that either you have already gotten it or will get it (I’m in the former category.) Not expending any further mental energy on covid, and not taking any particular measures to avoid it. That’s where I’ve been for at least the past 3-4 months.

[jacoavlu]

Is anyone here willing to admit to having covid fatigue and now total covid indifference? Vaccinate, accept that either you have already gotten it or will get it (I’m in the former category.) Not expending any further mental energy on covid, and not taking any particular measures to avoid it. That’s where I’ve been for at least the past 3-4 months.

that’s middle of the country for about a year now. Plus minus vaccinate (seen plenty die). Worked in hospital every day aside vacation

[mamaham]

My three kids all had Pfizer x 2, then got Covid (omicron I’m assuming) about 5 months (oldest 2) and ~1 month (youngest, who wasn’t eligible for the vaccine as early as the other 2) after their second vaccines. Only oldest had symptoms, and they were extremely mild and only lasted about 2 days. Barring some new evidence, I don’t plan on having them get a booster.

Same. My kids had vaccines in December. First one Got COVID two weeks ago. Then the next kid a couple days later and the last a couple days later. The symptoms were mild. I would not have even known one of them was sick except for testing bc of siblings. Do not plan on a booster either.

[triad]

Is anyone here willing to admit to having covid fatigue and now total covid indifference? Vaccinate, accept that either you have already gotten it or will get it (I’m in the former category.) Not expending any further mental energy on covid, and not taking any particular measures to avoid it. That’s where I’ve been for at least the past 3-4 months.

if you are low risk thats seems very reasonable. my dad is recovering from heart surgery so i'm extra cautious for a few weeks before i go to see him. He should remain vigilant as he is mid 70s diabetic, overweight, heart patient and over 6 months out from his last booster. i wish he weren't hesitant about getting his 2nd booster...

[pierre]

Is anyone here willing to admit to having covid fatigue and now total covid indifference? Vaccinate, accept that either you have already gotten it or will get it (I’m in the former category.) Not expending any further mental energy on covid, and not taking any particular measures to avoid it. That’s where I’ve been for at least the past 3-4 months.

Been there for a while too. I had a positive home test about a month after getting boosted. I’m ready to move on. I also think there are many other things I can do besides get the vaccine and wear a mask to decrease my risk (which is already very low).

[Tangler]

yes, boosting a population at baseline minimal risk, to provide transient protection against a virus that they have already contracted seems quite unnecessary. at the very least I would wait for a better booster.

Not covid related, but GREAT to “see” you on the forum!

You were always one of my favorites!

Thanks for posting!

[Tim]

WH: disappointed.
WH: DOJ will decide appeal.
WH: CDC will decide to appeal.
CDC demands an appeal.
An appeal is not based on facts or new evidence. It is based on only previous evidence, procedures and law. The CDC’s strategy is not to use evidence, defend opinions. At all costs, right or wrong.
My hypothesis is a new mental illness needs to be identified: Covidian Complex.
Symptoms: extreme measures and restrictions based on imaginary infections and risks.
Examples are many: protect the children so ages 2-5 the solution is require masks or require mask mandates out of an abundance of caution.

This mental illness is similar to a well known disease for every child in the US, Cooties.
“US
a children's term for an imaginary germ or repellent quality transmitted by obnoxious or slovenly people”
I would not be surprised if the WH , DOJ, CDC Fauci and the whole gang introduced new data for masks preventing Cooties.

This Covidian Complex seems to be widespread and it’s cause is unknown. We have children running the government. No data, no common sense, lost touch with reality.