Medical Discussion of Coronavirus

[StateOfMyHead]

There is a lot of crazy out there in the general public. That level of crazy tends to carry over into similar percentages of many professions.

I was certain that is true based on some of the folks I interact with on a daily basis but the sheer numbers that have been brought to light over the past 5 years is frightening.

[CordMcNally]

I was certain that is true based on some of the folks I interact with on a daily basis but the sheer numbers that have been brought to light over the past 5 years is frightening.

Social media makes it really tough for someone to be active on it and hide the crazy. It spills out at some point. Politics also seem to bring out the crazy in prone individuals. You throw politics on to social media and it basically turns into the Nextdoor app.

[Lordosis]

Social media makes it really tough for someone to be active on it and hide the crazy. It spills out at some point. Politics also seem to bring out the crazy in prone individuals. You throw politics on to social media and it basically turns into the Nextdoor app.

A good reason I don't use social media. Only you guys know how crazy I am.

And the people I work with...

And my family...

And my neighbors...

[StarTrekDoc]

So us posting pics of our 🐕 daily is some sort of crazy? Them are fighting words

[CordMcNally]

So us posting pics of our 🐕 daily is some sort of crazy? Them are fighting words

If your dog has its own social media account then yes.

[Zaphod]

I don't have any raw data to back this up but I think if you've had COVID in the last several months (i.e. the delta variant) then I think you're probably covered fairly well as opposed to getting COVID previously from a different variant but I blanket recommend anyone who has not gotten the vaccine to get it, regardless of previous infection, unless they've been told by a reputable physician (not a naturopath lecturing at a school board meeting) to not get it.

yes this makes sense. unfortunately there will be a lot of people from the first wild type strain that catch delta, and again, oddly, will be surprised with how virulent it is.

[pulmdoc]

I think we might be seeing a question with kids who have had MIS-C and are now eligible for the vaccine. if I had kids in that situation I doubt I would give them the vaccine at this point.

Fair enough, although I'd put that in the GBS category (untested and unlikely to ever be)

[Hatton]

So us posting pics of our 🐕 daily is some sort of crazy? Them are fighting words

You are posting photos of my dog LuLu now. She looks just like that emoji.

[sweetnpsycho]

Its laughable to compare the few who had reactions to the vaccine with the 500,000 who died from covid. Especially when looking at the denominators for each. But sure, these are just anecdotal "stories" to compare.

And based on current data, the answer to your question on prevention is "both".

Still waiting to hear of an example when a vaccine has caused long term complications that aren't readily apparent within a year. Meanwhile reduced lung function, renal failure requiring dialysis are already known with covid (*plus you know death), plus all the other examples in history of viruses causing complications. You can spout all you want, but the science is clear on this. I can also share stories of how seatbelts may cause injuries, but I'm still wearing one because I understand the statistical likelihood of which one is more likely to lead to injury.

Perhaps if all sources are saying the same thing, it might not be an echo chamber but actually may be true? Have you actually walked through any ICU in the past year during a surge?

I guess you've never heard of gulf war syndrome regarding your vaccine challenge. And why are you comparing it to other vaccines. How does COVID vaccine work? Do other vaccines work the same way?

US government has history of been nefarious under the guise of helping people medically. Look up Tuskegee Study.

Regarding your last question, isn't that looking for selection bias?

As physicians, we are supposed to "first do no harm". I honestly can't say the experimental vaccine will do no harms. VAERS reports has been trending up significantly.

I was expecting higher caliber response with data and what not in support of COVID vaccines. If you're willing to provide data, I have data available as well.

The option of vaccine or no-vaccine as the main determinants regarding protection against COVID is so myopic and may even be the wrong criteria to select for.

[billy]

I guess you've never heard of gulf war syndrome regarding your vaccine challenge. And why are you comparing it to other vaccines. How does COVID vaccine work? Do other vaccines work the same way?

US government has history of been nefarious under the guise of helping people medically. Look up Tuskegee Study.

Regarding your last question, isn't that looking for selection bias?

As physicians, we are supposed to "first do no harm". I honestly can't say the experimental vaccine will do no harms. VAERS reports has been trending up significantly.

I was expecting higher caliber response with data and what not in support of COVID vaccines. If you're willing to provide data, I have data available as well.

The option of vaccine or no-vaccine as the main determinants regarding protection against COVID is so myopic and may even be the wrong criteria to select for.

If you're referring to pyridostigmine causing gulf war syndrome- 1- its not a vaccine (in your analogy its more like monoclonal antibodies), and 2- why aren't all the people on it for myesthenia gravis having the same syndrome? Why isn't everyone exposed to anticholinesterase inhibitors after general anesthesia experiencing the same prolonged effects? Perhaps the other conditions of the gulf war (burning oil drums, pesticides, destroying Iraqi weapons, etc) and PTSD from war had more of a causative effect, but I'll let some VA docs chime in on that.

You do know that this is not the first time mRNA vaccine have been used in clinical trials, right?

Not denying tuskegee

You never answered the question, perhaps you have your own selection bias, but I invite you to visit any ICU in any part of the pandemic currently.

If you haven't seen actual data in support of COVID vaccines, I can't help you- it's literally everywhere. Including earlier in this thread. But just to play your game, >350 million doses of vaccines given, no real significant number of deaths (7,000 died after a vaccine shot- from anything, not from the vaccine- https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019...se-events.html). Just under 50 million covid cases, >600k deaths. Not sure what more data you want. You keep saying you have data, yet I havent seen you produce anything. I'm not denying some may have some effect from the vaccine, but it is way less likely than having long term effects from COVID, and less significant. Vaers is also full of "my arm hurt" reports.

You're obviously either trolling or unwilling to accept facts and change your thinking. I'm done wasting my time engaging.

[StarTrekDoc]

Please don't chase white rabbits down holes.

[G]

Vaers is also full of "my arm hurt" reports.

For a day or so, I was pretty alarmed that Pfizer gave me lymphoma two days after my shot. Luckily, my adnexal mass resolved in two more days, so I can start recommending vaccinations again.

[pierre]

The option of vaccine or no-vaccine as the main determinants regarding protection against COVID is so myopic and may even be the wrong criteria to select for.

What criteria do you propose we look at? I think there are other things we can do to decrease M&M from COVID in addition to the vaccine. But they require time and effort.

[pierre]

For a day or so, I was pretty alarmed that Pfizer gave me lymphoma two days after my shot. Luckily, my adnexal mass resolved in two more days, so I can start recommending vaccinations again.

Axillary?

[G]

Axillary?

LOL! testicular!