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  • Originally posted by Kamban View Post

    The better option would be to pass the costs of all these swabs, tests and N-95 on to that person or their insurance. The insurance should then pass it on to them since they have chosen to not get the vaccine.

    When will we start having a backbone. The insurance does denials left and right on so many tests and procedures. Why not do it where it matters.
    Cause the taxpayers are footing all the costs of these testings. o/w we would absolutely be seeing the costs passed through and/or denials.

    As I've said before -- future generations will feel the $3+Trillion spending we've done to date in direct Covid.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by StarTrekDoc View Post
      As I've said before -- future generations will feel the $3+Trillion spending we've done to date in direct Covid.
      And yet the stock and real estate markets are on fire. How can that even make sense?

      Comment


      • Originally posted by billy View Post

        Big difference between vaccinated vs unknown crowds, and ? if testing was done. No chance sturgis is filled with 100% vaccinated participants. I'd say the same for the concert. Dont know about obama's, but if they were vaccinated guests they should advertise that.
        Minus the fact there were big tents set up so it wouldn't necessarily be considered fully outside. Minus the fact that Martha's Vineyard is currently under 'High Transmission' per CDC guidelines. It's terrible optics but that's par for the course that we have seen from government officials and the so-called ruling class.

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        • Originally posted by CordMcNally View Post

          Minus the fact there were big tents set up so it wouldn't necessarily be considered fully outside. Minus the fact that Martha's Vineyard is currently under 'High Transmission' per CDC guidelines. It's terrible optics but that's par for the course that we have seen from government officials and the so-called ruling class.
          If everyone was vaccinated and tested negative beforehand, with the caterers also tested and wearing masks (I don't know if this is true or not, it's just hypothetical), why would where it is held matter? It would be the safest party in America. Isn't that the whole point of being vaccinated/vaccine passports? Again, I'm not saying this happened, but if it did, then yes it is very different from a concert, rally, burning man, or sturgis where vaccine status is not checked.

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          • Originally posted by billy View Post

            If everyone was vaccinated and tested negative beforehand, with the caterers also tested and wearing masks (I don't know if this is true or not, it's just hypothetical), why would where it is held matter? It would be the safest party in America. Isn't that the whole point of being vaccinated/vaccine passports? Again, I'm not saying this happened, but if it did, then yes it is very different from a concert, rally, burning man, or sturgis where vaccine status is not checked.
            Again, it's just bad optics given the timing. I agree the whole point of being vaccinated is to be able to go back to normal. Tell the CDC that.

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            • Originally posted by Lordosis View Post

              As an atheist I never get out of anything (other than church) good thing I actually want this vaccine.
              Isn't that good enough though? ;-)

              But let's be real, how many religions actually forbid the vaccine? And what do you show for proof that you actually believe what said religion forbids? Anyone that doesn't want the vaccine will just use the religious exemption as the excuse. I'm in UT where what, 70% of the population is Mormon? And 66% of people eligible for the vaccine have gotten a shot, and the religious leaders have called the vaccine " a literal godsend' . . . And yet I know Mormons who will declare a religious exemption ( I'm at the VA where clinical employees have been mandated to get the vaccine). With a religious exemption in place I'm not sure even a mandate can save us from our own stupidity.

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              • Originally posted by wideopenspaces View Post

                Isn't that good enough though? ;-)

                But let's be real, how many religions actually forbid the vaccine? And what do you show for proof that you actually believe what said religion forbids? Anyone that doesn't want the vaccine will just use the religious exemption as the excuse. I'm in UT where what, 70% of the population is Mormon? And 66% of people eligible for the vaccine have gotten a shot, and the religious leaders have called the vaccine " a literal godsend' . . . And yet I know Mormons who will declare a religious exemption ( I'm at the VA where clinical employees have been mandated to get the vaccine). With a religious exemption in place I'm not sure even a mandate can save us from our own stupidity.
                If I were a church leader I wouldn’t give out an exemption unless I saw the physician’s tax return and verified they donated 10% of last year’s AGI to the religious cause (they could always write out a check for the balance on the spot).

                Never let a crisis go to waste!

                Comment


                • Originally posted by billy View Post

                  Big difference between vaccinated vs unknown crowds, and ? if testing was done. No chance sturgis is filled with 100% vaccinated participants. I'd say the same for the concert. Dont know about obama's, but if they were vaccinated guests they should advertise that.

                  Full disclaimer- I hosted a 55 person fundraiser earlier this summer for my wife's cancer foundation. Only those who were vaccinated were invited, and I asked everyone to get tested within a few days before the event. Some complained about the testing, I told them I would refund their donation if they didn't want to test. I didn't want to be the host of a super spreader event especially with cancer patients present. Honestly it was safer than eating in the "physician" OR lounge daily.
                  First, I hope your fund raiser was extremely successful. I applaud your efforts to keep it safe.

                  My point was not to have an opinion or signaling on any event. It was the messaging and enforcement is highly politicized and unequal. That is a tit for tat senseless and purely nonproductive debate that adds zero of value.
                  Fact: private plane are subject to FAA regulations, including health checks. Masking rules are not being enforced equally as the airlines and at the airports. The only difference is the person formal responsible for enforcement in the plane or facilities.
                  I also try not to resist throwing shade at those in your doctors lounge, Obama’s Bday attendees, concert goers, or Sturgis bikers. 20 kids got thrown off of a flight because one changed seats with an adult that requested her to change. Personal biases and guilt by association has permeated our nation. That is a slippery slope.
                  I speculate that many didn’t mask in private planes. Not many fly to Sturgis, so no need to discuss.
                  Iceland has something like 70% reinfect for vaccinated people. THEY tout this as defending herd immunity over vaccinations and lax government regulations. That doesn’t mean that applies to the USA. Maskless Democrats (on a private flight get reinfected. So what? Unequal enforcement and personal bias and guilt by association advocating for attention. I speculate many attending the birthday thing didn’t wear masks and private pilots don’t have employers and tend to be “independent thinkers”. Yes, that is a personal bias and guilt by association judgement based on my personal experience. I am trying mightily to eliminate this related to all aspects of Covid.

                  When you have a 60th Bday bash for your wife, pm me and I would love to bring a gift (if I am still kicking). Best of luck, I am sure the party will be one for the ages. Yes, any rules are fine. I have no idea what Obama’s rules were nor do I care. Hope he enjoyed it. Not sure his daughters attended. No mention. I prefer smaller friends and family rather than business birthday stuff.
                  Best wishes to your wife whenever her bday is.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Lithium View Post

                    If I were a church leader I wouldn’t give out an exemption unless I saw the physician’s tax return and verified they donated 10% of last year’s AGI to the religious cause (they could always write out a check for the balance on the spot).

                    Never let a crisis go to waste!
                    Prosperity theology is big business. You might develop a side gig (1099 of course) consulting or setting up a table to issue the forms certifying compliance at the stadium events. Consider an online option for the TV and online streaming services. You don’t need to be a church leader, percentage of collections count. New donations have value. Doesn’t impact nonprofit status because you are a vendor. You seem to have many talents. Prosperity theology is very flexible. Good luck.

                    Comment


                    • The only religion that I am aware of that routinely gets religious exemptions for things is Christian Scientists. I took care of some of these people who had married out of their religion. They reject all healthcare. They got exemptions to not vaccinate the baby. They refused diabetes testing etc. They just wanted a hospital delivery. Not sure what would happen if a major problem occurred. These people are likely getting exemptions from the vaccine.
                      Rand Paul is optho. His father Ron Paul was OB/Gyn.
                      Is there good evidence that Moderna is superior to Pfizer?

                      Comment


                      • https://www.cnbc.com/2021/08/09/dr-s...ave-in-us.html

                        This just convinced me that measures in schools are very reasonable.Why? No sense in monitoring whether a student has an unvaccinated family member, just wear a mask and be done with it.

                        Dr. Scott Gottleb presented a very plausible scenario in a non confrontational way.

                        It is so contagious, unvaccinated would be smart to “hide” or “isolate”. Delta will probably find you eventually absent vaccination or precautions.

                        No jabs at any location or segments. Optimistic messaging and not peddling the fear and gloom or calling someone a “killer”. I just think “stay at home” is more persuasive. The tone is different.

                        I hope the conclusion is right.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Hatton View Post
                          They just wanted a hospital delivery. Not sure what would happen if a major problem occurred.
                          I'm certain I would not have been willing to find out.

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                          • Jaqen Haghar MD was it you who brought up that smoking could be protective? Well, Nature has a response for you.

                            https://www.nature.com/articles/s41533-021-00223-1

                            In all reality, the real answer is probably that it's unknown/insufficiently studied at this point. The article alludes to the bias in the preprinted articles released, which is likely the problem with a lot of information/misinformation floating around.

                            I don't know and I was wrong are two phrases that seem to be lacking by all parties.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Hatton View Post
                              The only religion that I am aware of that routinely gets religious exemptions for things is Christian Scientists. I took care of some of these people who had married out of their religion. They reject all healthcare. They got exemptions to not vaccinate the baby. They refused diabetes testing etc. They just wanted a hospital delivery. Not sure what would happen if a major problem occurred. These people are likely getting exemptions from the vaccine.
                              Rand Paul is optho. His father Ron Paul was OB/Gyn.
                              Is there good evidence that Moderna is superior to Pfizer?
                              I applaud two states who are on opposite side of the spectrum and cannot be more different from each other, yet California and Mississippi disallow religious and personal medical exemptions. Only medical contraindications allowed. I wish more states would follow their example.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Lithium View Post

                                If I were a church leader I wouldn’t give out an exemption unless I saw the physician’s tax return and verified they donated 10% of last year’s AGI to the religious cause (they could always write out a check for the balance on the spot).

                                Never let a crisis go to waste!
                                Hahaha I think you might have missed your calling in life. It's not too late to start your own religion. . .

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