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  • Originally posted by Sampter View Post
    I don't really understand why you are getting all bent out of shape about masks. That is so July 2020. Either wear them or not. Mask mandates are not going to happen or be enforced so those that want to wear them will, those that don't, won't.

    I agree about asking if they were vaccinated for patients that get Covid, does seem a little awkward. It is a little like shaming and we know that shaming people has never worked to try and improve health. However, it is important to know to track how well the vaccines are working with these variants.
    Exactly!

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    • Originally posted by G View Post

      I only bring up the regret issue if they have to go to the OR for the fight bite...otherwise, I applaud them for punching the wall instead of someone's face!
      I find that the people who typically punch walls would be in much worse shape if they would have punched another person.

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      • Originally posted by K82 View Post

        "Cherry picked articles"? I stated that there are studies showing some benefit. My point is that the studies that show no benefit don't get mentioned. If the benefits are "enormous" I think the data would be conclusive.

        I do think that wearing a mask helps stop droplets from coughs or sneezes from symptomatic pts. I don't think there is strong evidence that its helpful for non-symptomatic people to wear them.

        I disagree that the risk of wearing a mask is zero. I have eaten out and watched my server grabbing at their mask in the front to adjust it and then touch my water glass and menu. I think it definitely can be counter productive.

        Yesterday a colleague told me he saw a guy on the golf course all by himself with a mask on. What are we creating with phobias down the road for people, especially kids with this behavior?
        You're comparing different scenarios, and quoting some of those aritcles out of context, and didnt quote the ones showing a benefit. The ones you quotes are too big, broad and unfocused to even remotely have a chance to do it.

        Masks are not harmful, thats just a stupid thing to say.

        You're saying it isnt helpful for a server who is wearing it improperly, big deal, I would say wearing it in a restaurant is stupid and makes no sense at all and wont help even if covid was in the air. You take it off to eat, again, unless everyone is doing it (which we wont) it doesnt matter.

        Your studies were terrible, its good that we dont discuss terrible studies. What about the same type of BS that was discussed about Ivermectin? Then it turns out the study was flat out fraudulent. Get over your mask issues, some will wear some wont, no one cares.

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        • Maybe it might be a good idea to drop this discussion on masks since it has run its course and no one is changing anyone's mind any time soon.

          Wear if you want to, don't wear if you don't.

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          • Originally posted by Sampter View Post
            I don't really understand why you are getting all bent out of shape about masks. That is so July 2020. Either wear them or not. Mask mandates are not going to happen or be enforced so those that want to wear them will, those that don't, won't.

            I agree about asking if they were vaccinated for patients that get Covid, does seem a little awkward. It is a little like shaming and we know that shaming people has never worked to try and improve health. However, it is important to know to track how well the vaccines are working with these variants.
            "bent out of shape". I guess trying to point out studies that refute their efficacy is now being labeled "bent out of shape"? Why do you and other like minds insist on the inflammatory language?

            Mask mandates are making a comeback in several areas of the country. They are still required at all the hospitals I cover.

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            • Originally posted by K82 View Post

              "bent out of shape". I guess trying to point out studies that refute their efficacy is now being labeled "bent out of shape"? Why do you and other like minds insist on the inflammatory language?

              Mask mandates are making a comeback in several areas of the country. They are still required at all the hospitals I cover.

              Sorry, you are bent out of shape if complaining about having to wear a mask in a healthcare setting. The evidence clearly shows that healthcare workers wearing cloth masks while taking care of respiratory inpatients is bad (which obviously is not done in America). Wearing surgical masks doesn't harm anything, and likely helps. Doing our best to keep patients safe is rule #1 of being a doctor.

              At a baseball game, I'm with you.

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              • Originally posted by Sampter View Post


                Sorry, you are bent out of shape if complaining about having to wear a mask in a healthcare setting. The evidence clearly shows that healthcare workers wearing cloth masks while taking care of respiratory inpatients is bad (which obviously is not done in America). Wearing surgical masks doesn't harm anything, and likely helps. Doing our best to keep patients safe is rule #1 of being a doctor.

                At a baseball game, I'm with you.
                Totally agree with you related to taking care of respiratory inpts, or any symptomatic pts. Walking down hallways in non-pt areas, in cafeterias, in board meetings, at tumor conference, doesn't seem to be needed, and yet its mandatory.

                Maybe I'm an outlier with this but I suspect there are a lot of Docs reading this who agree with me but don't want to be ostracized by supporting my contentions. I think the vitriol directed at me from some of you is intended to silence any others who may agree.

                Also, if you don't like reading my posts, skip them.
                Last edited by K82; 07-21-2021, 12:19 PM.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by K82 View Post

                  Totally agree with you related to taking care of respiratory inpts, or any symptomatic pts. Walking down hallways in non-pt areas, in cafeterias, in board meetings, at tumor conference, doesn't seem to be needed, and yet its mandatory.

                  Maybe I'm an outlier with this but I suspect there are a lot of Docs reading this who agree with me but don't want to be ostracized by supporting my contentions.

                  Also, if you don't like reading my posts, skip them.
                  We have to wear them pretty much everywhere at the office and hospital except we do not at meetings now. Not sure why but it was deemed safe if everyone at the meeting is vaccinated you can unmask.

                  Other than work I only wear a mask in the few places that require it.

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                  • Originally posted by Lordosis View Post

                    We have to wear them pretty much everywhere at the office and hospital except we do not at meetings now. Not sure why but it was deemed safe if everyone at the meeting is vaccinated you can unmask.

                    Other than work I only wear a mask in the few places that require it.
                    We're still expected to wear them at meetings even though we're all (presumably) vaccinated. Your hospitals are somewhat more enlightened!

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                    • Originally posted by Lordosis View Post

                      We have to wear them pretty much everywhere at the office and hospital except we do not at meetings now. Not sure why but it was deemed safe if everyone at the meeting is vaccinated you can unmask.

                      Other than work I only wear a mask in the few places that require it.
                      They should be doing meetings over the phone or on zoom - or even better just sending an email. I’m guessing most places don’t because everyone just tunes out. If one person is diagnosed with COVID, does the whole group have to undergo isolation after contact tracing?

                      I wonder what the NNM is before an unvaccinated or partially vaccinated person is in attendance. Anecdotally, there are plenty of health care workers who have declined the vaccine or are still waiting, but none of them are MD’s.

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                      • COVID is an airborne virus. 6 feet of distance is NOT a safe radius, especially in indoor spaces. Numerous case reports of people being infected in restaurants, cruise ships, office buildings even when they never came within 6 feet of the index case. Mask mandates that allow unmasking indoors as long there is 6 feet of distance will allow infection to continue to happen.
                        ​​​​​
                        Good masks worn well definitely cut down the rate of symptomatic COVID infection. Good masks worn poorly (falling down from nose, big gaps on edges, pulling down under chin, etc etc) will not.

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                        • Originally posted by Lithium View Post

                          They should be doing meetings over the phone or on zoom - or even better just sending an email. I’m guessing most places don’t because everyone just tunes out. If one person is diagnosed with COVID, does the whole group have to undergo isolation after contact tracing?

                          I wonder what the NNM is before an unvaccinated or partially vaccinated person is in attendance. Anecdotally, there are plenty of health care workers who have declined the vaccine or are still waiting, but none of them are MD’s.
                          I don't know about everyone else but I am tired of zoom meetings. Most meetings are useless and not necessary but over zoom that is only worse. Some people like it and it will always be an option but I prefer to actually meet with people. I have even started shaking hands again :O

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                          • Originally posted by Lordosis View Post

                            I don't know about everyone else but I am tired of zoom meetings. Most meetings are useless and not necessary but over zoom that is only worse. Some people like it and it will always be an option but I prefer to actually meet with people. I have even started shaking hands again :O
                            Many meetings are much better in person. I typically prefer in person meetings. There's only so much predictable Microsoft Teams/Zoom/Go To Meeting issues that occur every minute that I can take.

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                            • So I haven’t had zoom meetings but if they are as big a waste of time as our staff meetings, can’t you just get work done while you’re marked present? I agree that a zoom meeting sounds miserable if you are actually monitored and ostensibly engaged.

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                              • Finally looked up the stats for Texas vs Japan (previous post by K82 mentioned japans jump in rates)- total covid deaths texas >50,000 vs Japan >15000- still want to use that as a case AGAINST masks helping?

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