Medical Discussion of Coronavirus

[CordMcNally]

huh they're doing over a million a day now and it's going to keep rising. that would be like 1 year and obviously as the number rises that time will decrease. I bet they will hit 3-5 million per day within the next couple weeks as they open it up to everyday people.

Where are they planning on opening it up to every day people in the next few weeks? Every state I'm familiar with has healthy people planned for late spring/summer and are just now getting to start schedule 65+ with co-morbidities. Also, are they counting people who receive their 2nd dose as a vaccination?

[Otodoc]

Same here. Mild arm soreness after first shot but had about 18 hours of shaking chills, myalgia, headache and fatigue after the second. Then back to feeling normal. The symptoms’ quick on quick off is really strange

Exactly the same for me. no symptoms after first shot. second shot seemed fine until about 12 hours later then got the most miserable myalgias and headaches. Like, kept me up all night severe. Lasted about 12 hours then was almost back to normal immediately.

[Panscan]

Well I would assume when Biden takes over there is going to be large effort to open it up and get as many people vaccinated as possible which will dwarf the current effort. Where I am anyone 75 or older plus first responders and public employees and etc can get it. That's a pretty large amount of people and obviously the criteria will become more inclusive over time.

[Kamban]

Same here. Mild arm soreness after first shot but had about 18 hours of shaking chills, myalgia, headache and fatigue after the second. Then back to feeling normal. The symptoms’ quick on quick off is really strange

My theory on this ( which is pure conjecture and could be plain wrong) is that the mRNA after the 2nd dose makes the spike protein in 12-15 hours and that is when the antibodies start to attack it and this leads to the chills, bodyaches and all the symptoms. Another 12-24 hours later the mRNA gets destroyed and there is no more spike protein being produced and the antigen-antibody reaction subsides as quickly as it started.

This may be the reason why the patients who had COVID before and are now getting the vaccine have the reaction after the 1st dose since they already have the antibodies in their system from the past infection, ready to attack the newly formed spike protein.

And older people have less robust immune response and hence they have less antigen-antibody reaction after the 2nd dose compared to a young adult who has produced more antibodies after the first dose of the vaccine.

Maybe an immunologist on this board can disprove all this conjecture. BTW, any published literature on how long does it take for the mRNA from the vaccine to produce the spike protein in the body?

[MPMD]

Well I would assume when Biden takes over there is going to be large effort to open it up and get as many people vaccinated as possible which will dwarf the current effort. Where I am anyone 75 or older plus first responders and public employees and etc can get it. That's a pretty large amount of people and obviously the criteria will become more inclusive over time.

yeah but that will also be countered w/ even more people refusing it.

it's going to get really interesting and probably violent when the vax cards turn into border passes etc. you're going to have a group of people who deny that it's a problem, refuse to mask, refuse to be vaccinated, and respond with hostility and/or violence to any restrictions on themselves b/c of this.

[StarTrekDoc]

The ramp up constraints aren't available arms. It's available sites to administer shots in an orderly manner .

Pfizer is hard to expand beyond healthcare or supersite.

Moderna is easier but still needs to be careful of dose waste if not done correctly.

Pharmacy locations are the logical place with large capacities. Cvs in target would be my prefereed setup to plan and replicate sites throughout the nation to standup and expand quickly at scale.

[Panscan]

yeah but that will also be countered w/ even more people refusing it.

it's going to get really interesting and probably violent when the vax cards turn into border passes etc. you're going to have a group of people who deny that it's a problem, refuse to mask, refuse to be vaccinated, and respond with hostility and/or violence to any restrictions on themselves b/c of this.

I envision basic things like going to chipotle requiring you to show proof of vaccination or since some airlines have ability to test, you may need to prove a negative test or vaccination to fly with them

People will refuse but it seems like public sentiment is increasingly in favor of it as a whole and that probably also improves with biden taking over and the associated messaging.

[MPMD]

I envision basic things like going to chipotle requiring you to show proof of vaccination or since some airlines have ability to test, you may need to prove a negative test or vaccination to fly with them

People will refuse but it seems like public sentiment is increasingly in favor of it as a whole and that probably also improves with biden taking over and the associated messaging.

that kind of thing will almost certainly come up before the SCOTUS.

not even sure what the right answer is here, obviously the public health consequences are massive, at the same time it's kind of nuts to require disclosure of any medical information to do something that has historically required none.

otoh private companies can usually refuse service as long as they aren't discriminating, otoh people are going to be asked to essentially flash a copy of their medical record. thorny question for sure.

[Kamban]

it's going to get really interesting and probably violent when the vax cards turn into border passes etc. you're going to have a group of people who deny that it's a problem, refuse to mask, refuse to be vaccinated, and respond with hostility and/or violence to any restrictions on themselves b/c of this.

And the flip side of it is when there are sufficient number of people who have taken both doses of the vaccine and worn masks long enough for all who have not had the vaccine available to get one. Then they will rebel against continued mask usage and social distancing when they are pretty much protected ( except for a small chance of getting the disease). They might refuse to wear the mask and show their VAX card as evidence.

So do the stores and other places of gathering only admit the vaccinated people in or admit all but make the non vaccinated wear masks or admit all and let the non vaccinated take the risk of getting the disease with its known consequences ( like we do for flu now). Or carry on this all people wear masks forever?

[CordMcNally]

I envision basic things like going to chipotle requiring you to show proof of vaccination or since some airlines have ability to test, you may need to prove a negative test or vaccination to fly with them

I'm not sure what they're going to do about people forging a vaccination card as it would not be difficult at this point. If the airlines go to having to have a negative test within a certain time frame then the airlines are going to be back at the taxpayer's doorstep wanting more money.

[CordMcNally]

The ramp up constraints aren't available arms. It's available sites to administer shots in an orderly manner .

Pfizer is hard to expand beyond healthcare or supersite.

Moderna is easier but still needs to be careful of dose waste if not done correctly.

Pharmacy locations are the logical place with large capacities. Cvs in target would be my prefereed setup to plan and replicate sites throughout the nation to standup and expand quickly at scale.

You would think they could use sports arenas as large scale vaccination sites. Those places are used to getting tens of thousands of people in and out in a few hours.

[CordMcNally]

And the flip side of it is when there are sufficient number of people who have taken both doses of the vaccine and worn masks long enough for all who have not had the vaccine available to get one. Then they will rebel against continued mask usage and social distancing when they are pretty much protected ( except for a small chance of getting the disease). They might refuse to wear the mask and show their VAX card as evidence.

So do the stores and other places of gathering only admit the vaccinated people in or admit all but make the non vaccinated wear masks or admit all and let the non vaccinated take the risk of getting the disease with its known consequences ( like we do for flu now). Or carry on this all people wear masks forever?

You're likely going to have an administration that encourages mask use for years. Smaller towns will return to normal much quicker and likely later this year while I'm afraid it will take bigger cities years to get back to normal at this point.

[Kamban]

otoh private companies can usually refuse service as long as they aren't discriminating, otoh people are going to be asked to essentially flash a copy of their medical record. thorny question for sure.

You cannot enter certain countries without proof of yellow fever vaccine. It is the same thing, except it is within this country. Airlines are private entity and can enforce rules. So can Amtrack. You want to not comply with it - you can drive.

[Peds]

You would think they could use sports arenas as large scale vaccination sites. Those places are used to getting tens of thousands of people in and out in a few hours.

disney

[Nysoz]

I can't read through all the recent messages about getting the vaccine, but I got my second pfizer vaccine yesterday. First dose mild sore arm, second dose mild sore arm 18 hours later.

my partner has sore arm first time, this time he's feeling the myalgia described as being in a bar fight.

the problem with disney is that you typically have to park somewhere take the shuttle/monorail while sitting next to a bunch of people before you actually get into disney. I guess you can utilize their booths where you pay for parking. just line up cars, 2 vaccine administrators per line of cars, one for each side. vaccinate in the arm closest to the window then they drive off.