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  • I had an EV back in the early 90s. Jeep Wrangler Power wheels. I remember it had to charge for 18 hours and barely ran for an hour. Needed to replace the battery every couple few years.
    Got the new version for my kids 25 years later. Zero improvements other then a built-in radio. My son is disappointed that it does not run as long now that it is colder.
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    Cheap lead batteries or worse Ni-Cad.

    @humbleinvestor – Yeah, the rear sits lower than usual sedan and entry is a bit awkward as well as finding how to open the door in the first place.   Surprised on the road noise aspect.  Usually the loudest part of a regular car experience is the engine.  There’s simply no EV engine noise.  You’ll have road noise no matter what.   FYI comfort setting is for steering wheel and chill mode is the amount of power acceleration –again very little noise from the engine regardless and regen on the braking.   Curious – what car do you both drive now?
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    In both ICE and EV unless some old muscle car the loudest part of driving is road noise and air resistance, which both EV and ICE are very similar with after 20ish mph. Sometimes there is a bit of engine sound, but eliminating it doesnt do much when there is just so much air/road noise at highway speed.

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    • I am somewhat rural so I have a skewed view but I wonder about how available super chargers are.  I know of a few in my area about 30 min away at a shopping mall and the rest are destination chargers which I understand to be slower.  As EVs become more popular  obviously there will be more popping up.

      I honestly would not mind pulling over for 30 min every few hours on a road trip.  However if there is a line and it is a 2 hour wait then what?  Has this started happening yet or are they keeping up with demand?

      Do the rest stops on the larger interstates have chargers?

      Or just places that want to lure people off the highway.  (People willing to drop a lot of $$$ on a car)

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      • @Zaphod - during any acceleration, engine noise is the primary factor. At cruising, road noise is the primary factor.  You'll know if you're on concrete vs new asphalt vs just a crappy road.  Wind noise doesn't become an issue unless 70+ or you have the radio off completely.  Tires and their pressure make a huge difference.  Tesla has high efficiency tires on and they like to blow it up to 42 PSI.  Most forums agree that if you lower to 36-38 on the OEM tires, it makes a significant difference.  I did.   Even better, went to sports tires with the new pair -  lost 5% efficiency but even more fun and even quieter too now.

        @Lordosis - yep. That's the main drawback/advantage of EVs right now.  If you have a garage and regular daily usage range is 200miles, overnight charging gives you full 100% without issue.  Same concept as destination chargers.   For road trips along distance stops, we've never had to wait.  The hard to predict ones are when you're in a metro area and locals are using it to recharge because they have free supercharging.   I, for the life of me, have no idea why most people dropping $70K+ on a car is willing to sit around to supercharge their car to save a few dollars -- like those driving 10 miles additional and sitting in 30min line for Costco gas.

        I charge at home, non-issue.  Go on routine trips to LA and no supercharger needed unless several days there and no destination charger.  At those occasions, timed with local shopping mall shopping with family and recharged easily.  Only time used superchargers significantly are large roadtrips.  Didn't wait at any of those pitstops with planned meals/breaks.

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        • @zaphod – during any acceleration, engine noise is the primary factor. At cruising, road noise is the primary factor.  You’ll know if you’re on concrete vs new asphalt vs just a crappy road.  Wind noise doesn’t become an issue unless 70+ or you have the radio off completely.  Tires and their pressure make a huge difference.  Tesla has high efficiency tires on and they like to blow it up to 42 PSI.  Most forums agree that if you lower to 36-38 on the OEM tires, it makes a significant difference.  I did.   Even better, went to sports tires with the new pair –  lost 5% efficiency but even more fun and even quieter too now.

          @lordosis – yep. That’s the main drawback/advantage of EVs right now.  If you have a garage and regular daily usage range is 200miles, overnight charging gives you full 100% without issue.  Same concept as destination chargers.   For road trips along distance stops, we’ve never had to wait.  The hard to predict ones are when you’re in a metro area and locals are using it to recharge because they have free supercharging.   I, for the life of me, have no idea why most people dropping $70K+ on a car is willing to sit around to supercharge their car to save a few dollars — like those driving 10 miles additional and sitting in 30min line for Costco gas.

          I charge at home, non-issue.  Go on routine trips to LA and no supercharger needed unless several days there and no destination charger.  At those occasions, timed with local shopping mall shopping with family and recharged easily.  Only time used superchargers significantly are large roadtrips.  Didn’t wait at any of those pitstops with planned meals/breaks.
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          Maybe true on the inside of the car, but probably more an insulation difference than anything else. On the outside, its a negligible difference starting at 30 km/h.

          https://www.toi.no/getfile.php/1340825/mmarkiv/Forside%202015/compett-foredrag/Lykke%20-Silent%20Urban%20Driving.pdf

          At slower speeds, like say urban ones EVs are significantly quieter overall.

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          • Its definitely the soundproofing of the car and the Tesla rep acknowledged (not sure if he intended to) that this car does not do a good job of. I drove with the radio off mostly to test that part. We have a 2 yr old Pilot that I was comparing it to and I agree with Zaphod that on highways it's mostly the road and wind noise. I wish they did a better job on the interior and sound proofing.

            The drive itself was cool with toy car feel changing the lanes and accelerating on the ramp to hwy. Wasn't a fan of regenerative breaking and turned it off after few mins of driving. May be it's better on highways.

            I dont know if Tesla does this often or a sign of slowing sales, they offered I can take it home for 24 hours on weekdays so I get a better feel for it.

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            • Wasn’t a fan of regenerative breaking and turned it off after few mins of driving.

              I dont know if Tesla does this often or a sign of slowing sales, they offered I can take it home for 24 hours on weekdays so I get a better feel for it.
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              New research is saying regenerative braking is dumb and wastes energy when you could just cruise, interesting topic.

              Thats kind of cool though, get a more day to day feel for it.

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              • Wasn’t a fan of regenerative breaking and turned it off after few mins of driving. May be it’s better on highways.
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                That's funny.  Regenerative braking/one pedal driving is one of the things I like most about my EV.  I hardly ever touch the brake pedal (only for unexpected stops like someone cutting me off or whatever).  It takes some getting used to, but after awhile it's second nature.

                I don't see how it could be wasteful though?  I'd really question the motives and sources of the "research" that tries to say it's wasteful.  I can easily recoup 0.5-1% battery power  while going down short hills around where I live.  That's real world range that I use to get home.  In an ICE vehicle that's energy lost to heat and wear and tear on your brakes.

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                • Energy cannot be created or destroyed.  If you start at a higher altitude then the destination then I could see having a net gain from the braking.

                  Sometimes you have to slow slow down and you can transfer some of that energy back but nothing is 100% efficient.  I can think of many scenarios where the braking does more harm then good.  highway cruising.  Country roads with little stopping.

                  I can think of many where it will help to a measurable extent. Traffic , lights, lots of hills

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                  • Energy cannot be created or destroyed.  If you start at a higher altitude then the destination then I could see having a net gain from the braking.

                    Sometimes you have to slow slow down and you can transfer some of that energy back but nothing is 100% efficient.  I can think of many scenarios where the braking does more harm then good.  highway cruising.  Country roads with little stopping.

                    I can think of many where it will help to a measurable extent. Traffic , lights, lots of hills
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                    Agree. I do like one pedal driving, fun, intuitive, but maybe not perfect.

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                    • No one is asking for perfection but at least the technology is advancing again.  For how long have we been waiting for flying cars?  I do not think we will get them because people suck at driving I could not imagine them flying.  But Self driving cars would really change travel.

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                      • Regarding regenerative braking, it also depends on how noticeable it is.  Drove an x3 this past weekend as a rental and the regen braking in eco mode was horrible.  As soon as you took your foot off the accelerator, it felt like someone was pushing the brake 1/4 to the floor.  Not bad at low speeds, but anything over 40mph and it sent everyone in the vehicle against their seat belts.  I'm primarily a one-pedal driver as well, but coasting on the interstate was almost impossible and I actually used the brake/accelerator more than I would have otherwise.  Ended up driving around in sport mode for the trip.  I've never felt anything that bad in a Tesla.
                        I should have been a pair of ragged claws. Scuttling across the floors of silent seas.

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                        • No one is asking for perfection but at least the technology is advancing again.  For how long have we been waiting for flying cars?  I do not think we will get them because people suck at driving I could not imagine them flying.  But Self driving cars would really change travel.
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                          There are some pretty sweet drone type flying vehicles now, but you'd need basically point to point automation which is less difficult than driving kinds, and they are spendy and cant hold much. Issue with flying cars isnt the tech, much like supersonic jets, etc...the costs simply dont justify the use case.

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                          • No one is asking for perfection but at least the technology is advancing again.  For how long have we been waiting for flying cars?  I do not think we will get them because people suck at driving I could not imagine them flying.  But Self driving cars would really change travel.
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                            There are some pretty sweet drone type flying vehicles now, but you’d need basically point to point automation which is less difficult than driving kinds, and they are spendy and cant hold much. Issue with flying cars isnt the tech, much like supersonic jets, etc…the costs simply dont justify the use case.
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                            We have not improved travel times in a while.  It is hard to drive more then a mile a minute.  And I do not fly often but with all the airport issues it seems to be taking longer then I remember as a kid.  Maybe it just seems longer now that I have kids with me but oh well.

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                            • True high speed rail along city corridors would make sense if we ever had the political will to accomplish it -- we don't.

                              The easiest is LA-Vegas.  Perhaps Elon will do his Boring on this --  who knows.

                               

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                              • True high speed rail along city corridors would make sense if we ever had the political will to accomplish it — we don’t.

                                The easiest is LA-Vegas.  Perhaps Elon will do his Boring on this —  who knows.

                                 
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                                Too much nimbyism cloaked in rules and regulations to get a real high speed rail in car dominated california.

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