Tesla

[StarTrekDoc]

Driving enthusiasts love speed and performance.  EVs have that in spades.   Without even trying, our Model 3 loves comings off the line and easily accelerates past most sports sedans without pushing hard since 100% torque at 0mph while most ICE need to get to 4000+ RPM to keep up.

Most homes have electricity these days and cars coming online pretty much are standard 150+ miles per charge, which gets to almost all commute and day trip situations.

[burritos]

StarTrekDoc wrote:

Driving enthusiasts love speed and performance.  EVs have that in spades.   Without even trying, our Model 3 loves comings off the line and easily accelerates past most sports sedans without pushing hard since 100% torque at 0mph while most ICE need to get to 4000+ RPM to keep up.

Most homes have electricity these days and cars coming online pretty much are standard 150+ miles per charge, which gets to almost all commute and day trip situations.

Click to expand...

People in multi unit homes without garage/electricity access might have an issue, but eventually landlords could offer or add electric access as a feature for their tenants.

But otherwise, the arguments you make are unassailable.

There's a video of the 2018 leaf beating a 370z in 70m:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=63&v=gPFLtAoI0sQ

At the top speeds, z's or most higher end cars will beat the leaf, but if you need to grab that spot in traffic, you can zip and take it.

[White.Beard.Doc]

The drivetrain of the electrics is incredible.  They are far superior in the low to mid speed range that all of us use every day, incredibly responsive from a standstill, amazing acceleration for merging into traffic, the ability to launch from a stoplight like a slingshot, but without any fanfare, just silent, instantaneous, warp speed.  And when you touch the accelerator, the response is immediate.  You don't realize how much of a delay there is in an ICE vehicle until you drive an electric.  And the car is full range every morning when I pull out of my garage.  It is a different concept compared to a gas powered car that you take to the gas station once a week.  I take a few seconds to plug in when I pull into my garage, and the solar panels do their thing to fill the tank.  I have been driving an electric vehicle for over 5 years, and I have charged away from home on 2 occasions in those 5 years.  I don't ever want to go back to an ICE.

As far as people who don't have their own driveway or garage, this year in the center of my city there are more parking garage charging stations than gas stations, and the number of charging stations continues to grow rapidly.

And yes, I admit it, I am a Tesla fanboy.  I can't help it, it is based on my personal experience.

[ACN]

Once Tesla redesigns the interior of the S, I will consider buying one in a few years.  By then, there should be plenty of luxury competitors (Porsche Mission E, Benz, etc).  I imagine by 2025, most new vehicles will be electric only.

[bean1970]

ACN wrote:

Once Tesla redesigns the interior of the S, I will consider buying one in a few years.  By then, there should be plenty of luxury competitors (Porsche Mission E, Benz, etc).  I imagine by 2025, most new vehicles will be electric only.

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agree on the interior. the inside is "no frills". there isn't anywhere to put my coffee in the back seat! no cup holders. no hooks for dry cleaning. That said, i love to drive it. mostly because of its immediate response time. in heavy traffic you can just pull out. my gas guzzler i have to have plenty of time to make a turn onto a busy street as it take too long to accelerate to 45mph. (vs nearly instantaneous in the Tesla). so when i'm driving my gas guzzler also known as the Range Rover...it takes me about 10-15 minutes extra time to get to work just to accommodate not being able to dart out on a turn. i have to wait until there is enough clearance in the traffic in the Range Rover. So annoying after driving the Tesla.

[VagabondMD]

burritos wrote:

StarTrekDoc wrote:

Driving enthusiasts love speed and performance.  EVs have that in spades.   Without even trying, our Model 3 loves comings off the line and easily accelerates past most sports sedans without pushing hard since 100% torque at 0mph while most ICE need to get to 4000+ RPM to keep up.

Most homes have electricity these days and cars coming online pretty much are standard 150+ miles per charge, which gets to almost all commute and day trip situations.

Click to expand…

People in multi unit homes without garage/electricity access might have an issue, but eventually landlords could offer or add electric access as a feature for their tenants.

But otherwise, the arguments you make are unassailable.

There’s a video of the 2018 leaf beating a 370z in 70m:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=63&v=gPFLtAoI0sQ

At the top speeds, z’s or most higher end cars will beat the leaf, but if you need to grab that spot in traffic, you can zip and take it.

Click to expand...

I love my new Leaf. It is the best car I have ever owned. It drives like a dream and is completely unassuming, the best of all worlds.

[RadMD]

After driving a Tesla, or any EV, it is very difficult to go back to driving an ICE (Internal Combustion Engine) car.  As stated above, the instant torque is so useful in everyday driving.  You can merge into traffic, pass other cars, and pretty much perform any maneuver with ease.  In an ICE car, there is so much fanfare, noise, and delay that makes driving unnecessarily difficult and unsafe.  It does literally takes seconds to plug my car in at home and I leave my house every day with a full "tank of gas" (full battery).   The added safety is a huge benefit as well (large front crumple zone due to lack of engine, increased structural rigidity due to battery pack, autonomous safety features etc.).

 

The Model 3 is on track to outsell even the ICE cars in its segment, including the BMW 3 series, Mercedes C Class, etc.  The EV revolution has begun and I cannot wait to see what the other manufacturers will have to offer in the future.  The Mission E is particularly exciting to me.

 

I do admit I'm another Tesla fanboy

[burritos]

Vagabond MD wrote:

burritos wrote:

StarTrekDoc wrote:

Driving enthusiasts love speed and performance.  EVs have that in spades.   Without even trying, our Model 3 loves comings off the line and easily accelerates past most sports sedans without pushing hard since 100% torque at 0mph while most ICE need to get to 4000+ RPM to keep up.

Most homes have electricity these days and cars coming online pretty much are standard 150+ miles per charge, which gets to almost all commute and day trip situations.

Click to expand…

People in multi unit homes without garage/electricity access might have an issue, but eventually landlords could offer or add electric access as a feature for their tenants.

But otherwise, the arguments you make are unassailable.

There’s a video of the 2018 leaf beating a 370z in 70m:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=63&v=gPFLtAoI0sQ

At the top speeds, z’s or most higher end cars will beat the leaf, but if you need to grab that spot in traffic, you can zip and take it.

Click to expand…

I love my new Leaf. It is the best car I have ever owned. It drives like a dream and is completely unassuming, the best of all worlds.

Click to expand...

While doing the internet search after the purchase(for bias confirmation/affirmation), I happened upon a post by a "Mr Mustache" who is a (non physician)FIREy kind of guy. I think WIC references him from time to time. Turns our he got a leaf 2 years ago. He still defers to the all mighty Tesla brand. However, with his due diligence report on the car, it has satisfied my decision at least for the next 5-6 years till I can pass it along to my kid. I'm not a super high earner, so the delta of dollars will go towards the 529's and possibly more solar.

[Panscan]

If having instant throttle response is the difference between being able to merge with traffic or not, probably not driving too safely.

[Panscan]

And could also probably learn how to drive without being constant gas and braking

[burritos]

Panscan wrote:

And could also probably learn how to drive without being constant gas and braking

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This is the game I constantly play. Drive the speed of the average flow of traffic(-2%), vs rubberbanding. The problem with this(which is not a problem for me) is that you get 3-4 seconds of space in front of you. So in tight traffic, people are always moving into the spot. Which again is not a problem with me. But the person behind me who benefits from not having to brake and not waste gas(unknowingly), often gets upset and does the zoom around me to fill that space. This causes transient episodes of being proximate to "road ragey" type behavior. Which again is not a problem for me, but if I'm with my wife, she tells me to speed up to close the space. So now I'm not only trying to zen-drive-traffic vs ungrateful fellow drivers, now I have to appease the wife(which we all know is absolutely mandatory).

Traffic waves, how one driver can make a differenec:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iGFqfTCL2fs

[Zaphod]

burritos wrote:

Panscan wrote:

And could also probably learn how to drive without being constant gas and braking

Click to expand…

This is the game I constantly play. Drive the speed of the average flow of traffic(-2%), vs rubberbanding. The problem with this(which is not a problem for me) is that you get 3-4 seconds of space in front of you. So in tight traffic, people are always moving into the spot. Which again is not a problem with me. But the person behind me who benefits from not having to brake and not waste gas(unknowingly), often gets upset and does the zoom around me to fill that space. This causes transient episodes of being proximate to “road ragey” type behavior. Which again is not a problem for me, but if I’m with my wife, she tells me to speed up to close the space. So now I’m not only trying to zen-drive-traffic vs ungrateful fellow drivers, now I have to appease the wife(which we all know is absolutely mandatory).

Traffic waves, how one driver can make a differenec:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iGFqfTCL2fs

Click to expand...

You just cant reliably do any kind of hypermiling type behavior in most situations. So many people hammer the gas just to brake at a red to waste the most gas possible and be super inefficient. I dont do that or ever worry about speeding as it wont make any difference aside from risk, wear/tear and higher costs, but I dont really do to much slow stuff either, its just not safe for the above mentioned reasons, it can create bad situations.

I think unless trump completely rolls back mpg targets every car will have some electrification soon, and then eventually as it just makes sense overall. Great for city driving and good performance in the places where ICE doesnt.

RadMD wrote:

The Model 3 is on track to outsell even the ICE cars in its segment, including the BMW 3 series

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This is not close to being true as of today. BMW 3 series sell more per month than current model 3s per quarter. We will have to see where it goes from here.

[Hober Mallow]

Zaphod wrote:

 

RadMD wrote:

The Model 3 is on track to outsell even the ICE cars in its segment, including the BMW 3 series

Click to expand…

This is not close to being true as of today. BMW 3 series sell more per month than current model 3s per quarter. We will have to see where it goes from here.

Click to expand...

Here's a table that shows Model 3 sales along with other comparable cars.

https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/model-3-reveal-effect-on-other-luxury-car-sales.68083/page-19#post-2725682.

I think this data is only for the US, and I'm honestly not sure of its accuracy.  It's obviously not an unbiased source.

Assuming the numbers are correct, the Model 3 outsold the BMW 3 series and 4 series, Audi A4 and A6, Lexus IS and ES, among others in April.  The Mercedes C class and E class still outsold it, but not by much.  If Tesla manages to increase Model 3 production even slightly, it will pass both in the next couple of months.

The interesting thing to me is the huge year over year drops in many of the cars on this list.  It's impossible to say how much is due to the Model 3, but I suspect it's part of the explanation.

• 3 series: 5%


• 4 series: 21%


• A4: 8%


• A6 24%


• C Class: 35%

In case it's not obvious, I'm also a Tesla fanboy.  We bought a Model S last year and I love it.  By far the best car I've ever driven.  The acceleration is addicting and the Autopilot makes SoCal traffic much more bearable.  I'm hopeful that they'll be able to get their production issues and be successful.

[StarTrekDoc]

Tesla is a sports sedan.  It's not a hypermiling machine.  As an EV it's efficiency really isn't that great.   It's tuned for performance.

Our Spark, OTOH, is quite efficient AND has performance.  --- it's a pocket rocket.  $90/month lease  and plenty of zip.    Strictly commuter car though with short legs of 85mi--100mi on a good hypermiling effort.

IMHO, the Bolt nearly gets it right.  If they extended it 9", it would be insanely popular --  problem is that EV still isn't as profitable as an ICE machine.  (definitely not for service centers of franchise owners).   Hence, legacy manufacturers are slow to kill off their ICE $$$ machines.

Telsa is bringing it to the performance sedan sector---it still dominates the lux sedan with a 8 year old machine.  the Model 3 is already affecting the Entry Sports Sedan and it hasn't even produced a single Dual motor/performance one yet that's releasing next week.  BMW M3-- Watch out.

The crazy part is that all EVs are great daily drive vehicles that outperform in nearly every situation compared to an ICE vehicle.

[Zaphod]

Hober Mallow wrote:

Zaphod wrote:

 

RadMD wrote:

The Model 3 is on track to outsell even the ICE cars in its segment, including the BMW 3 series

Click to expand…

This is not close to being true as of today. BMW 3 series sell more per month than current model 3s per quarter. We will have to see where it goes from here.

Click to expand…

Here’s a table that shows Model 3 sales along with other comparable cars.

https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/model-3-reveal-effect-on-other-luxury-car-sales.68083/page-19#post-2725682.

I think this data is only for the US, and I’m honestly not sure of its accuracy.  It’s obviously not an unbiased source.

Assuming the numbers are correct, the Model 3 outsold the BMW 3 series and 4 series, Audi A4 and A6, Lexus IS and ES, among others in April.  The Mercedes C class and E class still outsold it, but not by much.  If Tesla manages to increase Model 3 production even slightly, it will pass both in the next couple of months.

The interesting thing to me is the huge year over year drops in many of the cars on this list.  It’s impossible to say how much is due to the Model 3, but I suspect it’s part of the explanation.

• 3 series: 5%


• 4 series: 21%


• A4: 8%


• A6 24%


• C Class: 35%

In case it’s not obvious, I’m also a Tesla fanboy.  We bought a Model S last year and I love it.  By far the best car I’ve ever driven.  The acceleration is addicting and the Autopilot makes SoCal traffic much more bearable.  I’m hopeful that they’ll be able to get their production issues and be successful.

Click to expand...

So far this year the 3 series have sold nearly 10k cars per month, that is down significantly from last years. But it has almost nothing to do with the model 3. Model S, definitely. Model 3 barely sold 7k or so last quarter.

You'll have to wait for many months of data to roll in before you can see any effects, for the model 3, its just barely got started production wise.

 

In the next couple years there should be so many choices for vehicles that will fit almost any niche.