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Intermittent fasting--questions for those who've tried it

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  • #46
    Originally posted by canadianoutlaw View Post
    At its essence, its really fairly simple. Just skip breakfast. Nothing between dinner and lunch. Never been a big breakfast eater so I guess its something I've been doing for as long as I can remember. BMI 22.
    Do men benefit from thin privilege or is that just a female thing?

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    • #47
      Have been going about 5 months after getting introduced through the Faster Way to Fat Loss (FWTFL) program.

      I'm not super rigid about it and therefore probably not gaining all the benefits. I'm a peds intensivist and do a roughly 7on/7 off schedule so my fast times vary a bit week to week. When at work, I'm usually break my fast at 1230ish when my colleagues head to lunch. The end time varies depending on the schedule as our short call days last until 8pm when night shift gets in and so those are late days. On weeks when I'm off, I usually am ready to eat right at 12, and then depending on how we do dinner with the kids, may be done eating by 7pm or be later like 830p.

      I've found it not terribly difficult as I like that I can eat more satisfying portions less frequently easier than eating lots of small portions. Inertia I guess.

      I'm down about 13 pounds and that included the holidays. I got sick right around Thanksgiving and it lingered through most of December so I cut back on my workouts and only did the IF in the first half of the month. Traveling over the holidays and everything got thrown out the window, though continued wait until noon, so probably on a 12:12 schedule. Despite that my weight stayed the same which I felt really good about and found it extremely motivating to get back on track once I was back in my routine.

      I am also counting macros and carb cycling with my exercise routine. My low carb days are limited to 100g of net carbs which is actually a fair amount, so I don't feel deprived on those days.

      Now...all that said. If I had to say what has mattered the most in terms of weight loss...it would be that I've decreased my caloric intake and been more active since I did the FWTFL program in September. I think the IF helped as a framework to make it easier to decrease my calories, and I'd like to think the carb cycling has helped me look better in the mirror if anything, but at the end of all, still calories in less than calories out. Just a different tool out of the toolbox than what I used previously.

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      • #48
        Originally posted by bigredbeta View Post

        Now...all that said. If I had to say what has mattered the most in terms of weight loss...it would be that I've decreased my caloric intake and been more active since I did the FWTFL program in September. I think the IF helped as a framework to make it easier to decrease my calories, and I'd like to think the carb cycling has helped me look better in the mirror if anything, but at the end of all, still calories in less than calories out. Just a different tool out of the toolbox than what I used previously.
        IMHO IF is for autophagy. Weight loss is a secondary benefit..

        I've been recommending IF a lot for my patients for the past year. That and low carb. People who come to see the doctor probably are statistically more metabolically less healthy. If you've run out of "take these pills" to fix their problems, I find a discussion about IF and low carb very useful. Generally the recommendation is a physiologically reasonable recommendation for the metabolically sick. A sincere discussion about insulin, IGF, ketones, inflammation, and autophagy is never argued against by patients. Plus it's free, patients don't see you trying to "sell' something. People who want agency to fix themselves will appreciate it and maybe even adopt it. I find this to be 5-10% of patients. For the unwilling, they nod and say 'uh huh' and 'yes' a lot and then behave like teenage loiterers being exposed to classic music. It's my new bear spray for the whiny non compliant type.

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        • #49
          Apologies for beating a dead horse but for those who are interested:
          https://pharma.elsevier.com/pharma-rd/three-drug-development-strategies-to-combat-2019-novel-coronavirus/
          3. Investigate compounds that target autophagy

          Autophagy is a pathway used by cells to recycle damaged proteins and destroy pathogens, but some viruses can hijack the autophagy pathway to manufacture virus proteins [4]. Therefore, whether autophagy inhibition or activation would be more effective against SARS-CoV-2 infection needed further exploration.

          We used Pathway Studio and found 406 compounds that inhibited and 802 compounds that activated autophagy. In total, 33 of the compounds that activated (and none of the compounds that inhibited) autophagy were listed among the 121 drugs reported effective against coronaviruses. In addition, Gassen et al. found that blocking autophagy attenuation inhibited MERS coronavirus replication [5]. Both these findings suggest that activation of autophagy inhibits SARS-CoV-2 replication and autophagy-activating compounds should be investigated as antivirals.


          I presume the compounds that they studied were all in vitro lab studies. But 33 of the 121 compounds that were effective against coronavirus ACTIVATED autophagy. The pharma model to find a drug to promote autophagy is going to be 5 years too late for this pandemic. What else promotes autophagy that doesn't require FDA fast track approval? Shutting that pie hole and fasting. Is it presumptive to connect the dots from super BMI patients to the vents? Is it safe to say that the super BMI patients have not experienced much or if any substantive autophagy while they were breathing on their own? Continuous processed carb consumption is coming home to roost.

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          • #50
            Originally posted by burritos View Post
            Apologies for beating a dead horse but for those who are interested:
            https://pharma.elsevier.com/pharma-rd/three-drug-development-strategies-to-combat-2019-novel-coronavirus/


            I presume the compounds that they studied were all in vitro lab studies. But 33 of the 121 compounds that were effective against coronavirus ACTIVATED autophagy. The pharma model to find a drug to promote autophagy is going to be 5 years too late for this pandemic. What else promotes autophagy that doesn't require FDA fast track approval? Shutting that pie hole and fasting. Is it presumptive to connect the dots from super BMI patients to the vents? Is it safe to say that the super BMI patients have not experienced much or if any substantive autophagy while they were breathing on their own? Continuous processed carb consumption is coming home to roost.
            You posit an interesting theory regarding how viral replication could be linked to metabolic state. WCI has asked us to move all non-financial discussion of COVID to a single thread and he’s the sponsor of this forum, so probably best to halt the discussion here and to continue over there out of respect for the boss.

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            • #51
              Originally posted by pierre View Post
              I know there at least a few people here that eat one meal a day. For those that do it, how much do you estimate your calories are and how long does it take you to eat them?

              I find it difficult to eat 2k calories in a single sitting or even over a 2-3 hours. But I do like fasting and time restricted feeding windows.
              I'm obsessed with my fasting(dry). It's probably the most valuable thing that I've learned on this board(MissBonnie started it?). On my days that I work(3-4x's a week, which includes a roundtrip bike commute of 19 mi), I get in all my calories(which I don't count) in one 1-3 hr dinner sitting. Generally I start with a big salad, then anything and everything after that is fair game(healthy/non healthy/week old leftovers/newly cooked stuff/halloween candy/breakfast stuff/boxed goods). I started almost 2 years ago. I went from 138 to 130 in the first month and have been stable since. I do it primarily for health, not weight loss.

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              • #52
                Has anyone noticed age-dependence? Does IF work better if you’re younger versus older? Or the opposite?

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                • #53
                  So I am early 40s. I started IF about 2 years ago, and have been hit or miss with it. I would say about 3-4 days a week I am 16-8, and the others is closer to 14-10. I know that isn’t as strict as some. Occasionally I hit 18-6 (probably 1-2 days a week, max). I started getting into it after I was diagnosed with ulcerative colitis, and feel that it has helped me manage that a little better as well (more time for the colon to rest), and combined it with an exercise regimen where I lift weights 4-5 times a week and run ~3 miles 2-3 times per week. I got down from my post-steroid (for UC) high weight of 233 to 206 in about 10 months, and then managed to tear my ACL.

                  I gained most of that weight back because I was on crutches and NWB for 5 weeks before surgery (also tore my MCL that had to heal), and then for a couple of weeks after surgery. Now in the almost 3 months that I’ve been able to start working out again I’ve gone from 230 down to 220, but my body composition is completely different than it was before with my new weight-lifting regimen. I think that although my weight loss hasn’t been drastic it’s because I’ve lost some fat and gained some muscle. My goal is to get down to 190-195, and my version of IF will continue to be a big part of that.

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                  • #54
                    Originally posted by STATscans View Post
                    Has anyone noticed age-dependence? Does IF work better if you’re younger versus older? Or the opposite?
                    https://peterattiamd.com/lloydklickstein/

                    Fast forward to the 1hr41min53sec mark into talk. If you want to dig deep into the molecular biochemical physiology, the implication is that autophagy (the thing that keeps one well/young) gets degraded as you get older. It's probably like exercise and investing. It's always helpful, but it works better the earlier you habitualize it. Anything that makes your life easier and yummier generally opposes the effects of autophagy. The western lifestyle seeks to inhibit autophagy to its maximum.

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                    • #55
                      I routinely use intermittent fasting and stay pretty darn Keto. Weight went from 205 to 175, and I have held that weight now for 3 years. I now just fast once or so every week or two, usually for 36 hours. I have lost the weight, so autophagy and maintenance are the goals. You really need more than 16 hours of fasting to optimize autophagy. Energy is way up, triglycerides are down, and skin tags are all gone. I am a big fan of Thomas DeLauer's YouTube videos and follow a Meditarranean-style keto diet. Lots of fish, green leafy and cruciferous vegetables, grass finished beef, avocados. I try to eat as anti-inflammatory as I can.

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                      • #56
                        Originally posted by CMartel02 View Post
                        I routinely use intermittent fasting and stay pretty darn Keto. Weight went from 205 to 175, and I have held that weight now for 3 years. I now just fast once or so every week or two, usually for 36 hours. I have lost the weight, so autophagy and maintenance are the goals. You really need more than 16 hours of fasting to optimize autophagy. Energy is way up, triglycerides are down, and skin tags are all gone. I am a big fan of Thomas DeLauer's YouTube videos and follow a Meditarranean-style keto diet. Lots of fish, green leafy and cruciferous vegetables, grass finished beef, avocados. I try to eat as anti-inflammatory as I can.
                        Autophagy probably happens differently for different people at different times. It's also likely not happening evenly in every organ system. Other than taking tissue biopsies to identify cellular autophagasome per cell, everything is just a plausible narrative.

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                        • #57
                          https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2020/09/41...rk-weight-loss

                          UCSF. Randomized control study. IF doesn’t work. They’re right, I haven’t lost weight in two years.

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                          • #58
                            Originally posted by burritos View Post
                            https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2020/09/41...rk-weight-loss

                            UCSF. Randomized control study. IF doesn’t work. They’re right, I haven’t lost weight in two years.
                            Ouch!

                            I guess what is reassuring in terms of the "convenience factor" is - at least the results between the groups weren't that different. Meaning - even though there isn't some great benefit to skipping breakfast or having no snack before bed, there isn't much harm either (obviously assuming calories are the same).

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                            • #59
                              The overall weight loss was very small, not consistent with patients who are trying to lose weight. That's odd. There no doubt IF works for many people, call it behavioral or physiological or some combination of both, but many people who have not succeeded with traditional diets succeed here, and maintain the weight loss longer/indefinitely. I'd call this a strike against IF but not a death knell.

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                              • #60
                                I find it curious that thousands of studies are done every year, but from time to time, some unknown news editor picks a specific study to broadcast to the masses. Yes, IF has attracted a lot more interest of late. So that could be a reason. In fact there was a recent NEJM summary article promoting it. My guess is people who are biased for it(like myself), will continue on, but then I have a medical degree and have deep dived it extensively through the literature. But for the lay person who won't do this, they'll conclude that this is sufficient evidence to throw IF into the diet fad trash bin. Public confusion, check. Breakfast food interests, safe for another decade.

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