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  • #76
    Originally posted by rcw View Post

    Multiply that attitude by 325 million people in the US (and that's just one country) and you will see the problem.

    Confining my remarks to the arena of personal finance: The US public has been bamboozled by the auto companies into believing that they need buy and own big SUVs and big pickup trucks to drive around suburbia. And the US public willingly cooperated in that bamboozle. Advertising works. People conflate their self-image with the products they own. This is the root cause of much over-spending.

    And then people complain about increase in tax rates to repair the excess wear and tear on the roads.

    Kudos to the OP for driving so little in a year. But does it require a big truck to accomplish that function effectively? A vehicle is just a tool for getting people and sometimes some stuff from point A to point B.

    There is the issue of towing and hauling things. But how often is that necessary? What are the requirements of that function, and how could they most effectively be met? If it's a boat you haul to the lake once in the spring to put it in, and once back from the lake in the fall when you take it out, then I propose borrowing the FIL's truck to do that is an effective design solution (assuming good relationships with the FIL).

    My neighbor behind me in our typical suburban neighborhood bought a huge crew-cab truck. I've never seen it with more than 2 occupants, and I've never seen anything in the bed save for one set of golf clubs. They don't own a boat or an RV/trailer, and as far as I can tell, they don't camp. His commute to work is roughly the same as mine, about 12 miles one way.

    I acknowledge there are many situations that might reasonably call for personal ownership of a big pickup truck--maybe certain kinds of businesses, or a farm, or whatever, and I don't know if any of those factors apply here.
    For one thing, it’s the small cars that are overwhelmingly subject to “overspending,” not the big ones.

    And it isn’t companies persuading people that they need a big car.

    It’s multiple small children, car seats, sports gear, carpools, and toys to tow that makes it glaringly obvious that a Prius or Volt is laughably insufficient in every way.

    People are plenty capable of seeing the obvious in front of their eyes, in their daily life.

    Has nothing to with bamboozling. No marketing required.

    Free market economy. Buy the car you want, that fits your needs.

    Driving fewer miles is not virtuous.

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    • #77
      Originally posted by VentAlarm View Post

      Why not? By that logic, I should never buy a luxury. At what savings rate is it reasonable to start spending money on a luxury?
      No. Never is not correct.

      Buy it if you think the answer to this question is yes:
      ”Would having a new vehicle make me happier than investing another 65k in VTSAX at age __.”

      For me (Tangler), now, sept 2022, at age 49 with market down and no need the answer is no.

      For others the answer is a clear yes.

      I like my used civic. others love the big @$$ pickem up truck.

      You alone can answer the question.

      One day i might have: boat, truck, giant house etc.

      I have 3 brothers with trucks.........all happy with the decision to buy it.
      Last edited by Tangler; 09-29-2022, 06:47 AM.

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      • #78
        Originally posted by Turf Doc View Post
        I thought the point of being rich/building wealth was that you were supposed to be able to spend money on things that would bring you joy?
        Maximize joy, yes.
        Sure.
        If he wants it, buy it.

        Just don’t ask if it is “smart financially “

        Never smart financially to buy a new car when you have a car that is reliable.

        Zero percent is a great way to get people to buy, but you are still going to put money into a depreciating asset.

        If it makes you very happy, do it.

        Individual choice.

        Financially, a luxury.

        Comment


        • #79
          Originally posted by Lithium View Post
          in all honesty I would probably either go the private party route or just go to carvana and call it a day. I doubt I would budget more than $10k, possibly not even $7-8k. But I haven’t had the pleasure of changing vehicles in 13 years so I hardly remember how painful the process is.
          You may be surprised to hear that earlier this year when I was in the market, there was zero difference in price between new and used. Zero. Only difference was you could actually get a used car quickly, opposed to waiting several months for a new car to be ordered/manufactured

          I was always a used car guy, but the market earlier this year changed me

          Comment


          • #80
            Originally posted by CordMcNally View Post
            I want a picture of you standing in front of your new truck like it’s your first day of school.
            And holdup the loan agreement so proudly.
            Just like the tuition agreement for that private school for that kindergartner.
            Smile really big.

            Comment


            • #81
              Would you buy a 65k once in a life time vacation trip instead of the truck and pay it off with 0% financing over 5 years? What is the difference, the truck gives some utilitarian value, but if you already have a vehicle , then it doesn't matter. Would the vacation give you more joy and happiness and new memories that could not be recreated with a new truck? How is that any different than financing a new truck?

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              • #82
                Originally posted by Random1 View Post
                Would you buy a 65k once in a life time vacation trip instead of the truck and pay it off with 0% financing over 5 years? What is the difference, the truck gives some utilitarian value, but if you already have a vehicle , then it doesn't matter. Would the vacation give you more joy and happiness and new memories that could not be recreated with a new truck? How is that any different than financing a new truck?
                There is a lot wrong with this analogy

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                • #83
                  Let me rephrase the question, would you spend money on a trip with 0% financing and pay it off over 5 years ? What is the difference between spending money on an experience and paying it off over 5 years , vs spending on a "luxuary" item and paying it off over 5 years?

                  Comment


                  • #84
                    Originally posted by Random1 View Post
                    Let me rephrase the question, would you spend money on a trip with 0% financing and pay it off over 5 years ? What is the difference between spending money on an experience and paying it off over 5 years , vs spending on a "luxuary" item and paying it off over 5 years?
                    Is anyone offering 0% on a vacation? If so, I would take it.

                    Comment


                    • #85
                      Originally posted by Random1 View Post
                      Let me rephrase the question, would you spend money on a trip with 0% financing and pay it off over 5 years ? What is the difference between spending money on an experience and paying it off over 5 years , vs spending on a "luxuary" item and paying it off over 5 years?
                      Probably not, but 1) I’ve never spent more than $10k on a vacation and 2) a vacation wouldn’t improve my daily life every day going forward.

                      Comment


                      • #86
                        Originally posted by pierre View Post

                        Is anyone offering 0% on a vacation? If so, I would take it.
                        My daughter had two 0% vacations in two months between fellowship and starting attending. She also had 0% first month and security deposit on her apartment. Dang, 0% loan on moving and furnishings with the appropriate glam and glitter.

                        The $500 non-refundable application fee was waived.

                        Send me $500 and I’ll see what my wife says.
                        Dad’s bank is controlled by a loan committee of one. I don’t need to check, denied.

                        Dang, I wanted the $500 so bad. Daughter ran it up to the price of the truck. There is a connection.

                        Comment


                        • #87
                          Originally posted by 8arclay View Post

                          You may be surprised to hear that earlier this year when I was in the market, there was zero difference in price between new and used. Zero. Only difference was you could actually get a used car quickly, opposed to waiting several months for a new car to be ordered/manufactured

                          I was always a used car guy, but the market earlier this year changed me
                          Strange used car chip deal. this was why no rental cars were available…….chip shortages

                          Comment


                          • #88
                            Originally posted by Tangler View Post

                            Strange used car chip deal. this was why no rental cars were available…….chip shortages
                            Some used cars are at times worth more than the original purchase price.

                            Comment


                            • #89
                              Great thread. Lots of thought provoking answers.

                              I am personally in a similar situation.

                              It’s easy to walk in and get the new vehicle. But what message does that send to yourself, wife, kids etc. As the financial leader of my household, I have to practice the frugality that I preach.

                              My vote would be to stay off the hedonic treadmill. Hedonic adaptation is real. That truck will be the bees knees for a few months. Then it will be just another appliance.

                              You didn’t get to your level of savings, net worth/stability etc by engaging in financially self destructive behaviors like buying new vehicles to replace perfectly good ones. So why start now.

                              I am going to edit to say that I have a mid size Korean SUV. It’s “crappy”, but reliable and simple, safe and I love the way it drives. If I were in a sedan, I’d probably be more inclined to replace.

                              There’s more to this than just the numbers.


                              Last edited by dataentryspecialist; 09-29-2022, 07:39 AM.

                              Comment


                              • #90
                                Originally posted by Random1 View Post
                                Let me rephrase the question, would you spend money on a trip with 0% financing and pay it off over 5 years ? What is the difference between spending money on an experience and paying it off over 5 years , vs spending on a "luxuary" item and paying it off over 5 years?
                                It's best that somebody not owe money on something that they're no longer using. A vacation and a vehicle are very different things.

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