Too Frugal? - New Car

[Huggy]

things can be experiences depending on how you personally interact with them. ive worn raw denim for the past 10 years, jeans are a "thing" yet they're also an experience for me. they cost a lot but i get a lot of joy out of just putting on my freaking pants in the morning, and have for the last decade. I think the point is to make sure that the things you're buying actually do bring you joy, AND that you can afford it.

Your situation doesn't sound great for the sports car even assuming you can afford it (whats the rest of your budget look like btw?). I would rent something cool on the weekends and reevaluate after a year or so

What brand of raw denim?

[Fugue]

I think you’re misinterpreting what I said, or maybe I just wasn’t clear. My initial post was that it’s ok to buy it if he’s saving 20%. It’s not frugal, and probably a relatively poor decision, but it’s not crazy. I wouldn’t do it and I think it’s not necessarily wise, but it’s not crazy. I also mentioned how it’s different if it’s an impulse because he’s got $20k in his checking and crunched the numbers on a monthly payment vs. he has 80k in the bank and had a picture of this car over his bed since he was in high school.

My above comment was in response to the above poster saying his pet peeve was peoples advice skewing towards experiences over stuff. That’s a really silly thing to say. I’m not saying never buy nice stuff, just that it’s a somewhat ridiculous thing to suggest that it irritates you when a frugality minded forum suggests spending money on things that have been shown to more greatly influence your happiness. Experiences over stuff is a great rule of thumb, but, like all rules of thumb, isn’t a hard and fast law.

Look, you said yourself that everyone is different and everyone has different things that bring them value or joy in life. The original poster clearly stated that he wants a sports car and has wanted one for a while. Not sure why it’s a big leap to assume that getting a sports car will add to his quality of life. If that’s what he elects to spend his non-retirement savings on, I am all for it. As long as he has saved up the amount in cash and has all his other ducks in a row. I couldn’t possibly care less whether he spends it on a car or to sunbathe on a beach in Tahiti.

My point is that sometimes people post stating that they want X object and that it will bring them happiness and asking if they should get it. Regardless of what brings people happiness in the aggregate, we are currently talking about one poster who clearly has an interest in buying a car.

OP - For the record, leasing any car let alone a car that expensive is a terrible idea. You need to have that amount saved up in cash. If you want to play the leverage game because interest is so cheap that’s one thing (I would not do it) but you need to clearly have that amount saved up. If not, look at used models or wait until you’re in a better place financially. I personally did not pull the trigger until debts were gone (no mortgage at the time) and I’d clearly mapped out maintenance costs and sat on the decision for 3 months. And I bought used to get a considerably lower price than you. Over a year later even as a weekend driver it continues to be an awesome decision and no regrets.

[Turf Doc]

What brand of raw denim?

Flat head is my favorite brand!

[Huggy]

While routine experiences may often provide more happiness than routine material things, I don't buy into the notion that splurging on experiences provides more happiness than splurging on material things. A splurge is a splurge, and I don't believe that there is data to support the argument that routinely spending 10-20k+ on experiences with first-class tickets, fine dining, and 5 star hotels provides any more long-lasting joy than splurging on a nice wardrobe, car, house, etc.

[Panscan]

Look, you said yourself that everyone is different and everyone has different things that bring them value or joy in life. The original poster clearly stated that he wants a sports car and has wanted one for a while. Not sure why it’s a big leap to assume that getting a sports car will add to his quality of life. If that’s what he elects to spend his non-retirement savings on, I am all for it. As long as he has saved up the amount in cash and has all his other ducks in a row. I couldn’t possibly care less whether he spends it on a car or to sunbathe on a beach in Tahiti.

My point is that sometimes people post stating that they want X object and that it will bring them happiness and asking if they should get it. Regardless of what brings people happiness in the aggregate, we are currently talking about one poster who clearly has an interest in buying a car.

OP - For the record, leasing any car let alone a car that expensive is a terrible idea. You need to have that amount saved up in cash. If you want to play the leverage game because interest is so cheap that’s one thing (I would not do it) but you need to clearly have that amount saved up. If not, look at used models or wait until you’re in a better place financially. I personally did not pull the trigger until debts were gone (no mortgage at the time) and I’d clearly mapped out maintenance costs and sat on the decision for 3 months. And I bought used to get a considerably lower price than you. Over a year later even as a weekend driver it continues to be an awesome decision and no regrets.

agree with you about getting the car if it’s important to OP.

Leasing can be a great move. It’s not inherently bad or good it’s just a different transaction than buying. There are plenty of cars I’d want to lease but not own( euro sports cars for example) and there are plenty where the math for leasing sucks and purchasing is the way to go( such as a Tesla in current climate).

I have no idea what you mean with “ you need to have that amount saved in cash.” OP makes a ton of money and can easily cash flow a lease on an 80k car if they really want it. Putting money down on a lease is incredibly stupid and has 0 benefits both from a present value standpoint and a risk standpoint as if the car gets totaled there is a good chance you lose whatever you put down. It is basic math. You have a residual value at the end of the lease, a money factor( interest rate ) , a selling price for the vehicle and various incentives. Keeping cash equal to total value of payments is also silly from a missed opportunity instead of investing it.

[F0017S0]

This post has really induced some strong feelings on both sides.

[Nysoz]

And the op hasn’t responded. Probably still confused

[NaOH]

Wonder if OP will come back...

Anyway, I second what others have mentioned - you can get a helluva lot of sports car for way less than $70-80k.
Depending on what you like - handling, power, sound, presence - very doable.

Older Porsche Cayman? C5/C6 Corvette Z06? Caddy CTS-V? Miata with a turbo kit?

[VentAlarm]

Wonder if OP will come back...

Anyway, I second what others have mentioned - you can get a helluva lot of sports car for way less than $70-80k.
Depending on what you like - handling, power, sound, presence - very doable.

Older Porsche Cayman? C5/C6 Corvette Z06? Caddy CTS-V? Miata with a turbo kit?

This thread got me looking. Have you seen the 2022 corvette. Dang, that thing is pretty.

[CordMcNally]

The OP probably went from here to Mr. Money Mustache and saw some of them recommend routine dumpster diving then the OP probably just gave up on the internet.

[FreshPaint]

I understand what you’re trying to say, but I don’t think this kind of blanket generalization works well because it’s so dependent person to person.

I was in a similar position to the OP. Ended up buying a sports car (less money than OP) after my debts were gone about 2 years out of residency and saving over half my take home pay. Ended up buying my first house later on for <1x. Haven’t had a single splurge other than the car.

This is a pet peeve of mine. This forum, and others, skew heavily towards spending money on experiences. Everyone is always in favor of spending five figures on vacations, but when it comes to a car it’s seen as a foolish purchase and a gateway to bigger spending.

The simplest answer is this - save what you need to for retirement, more if you would like freedom earlier, and then spend the rest on what you deem to improve your quality of life. I would not recommend leasing, I think that’s foolish, but if you can afford the car you will be able to pay in cash.

Yea I feel the same way as you. Maybe I'm a boring person, but I'd much rather have a luxury car, nice clothes, and the newest iphone, rather than blowing money on airfare, hotels, and random expensive outdoors gear.

[F0017S0]

All this talk of a Miata reminds me of the original “Super Troopers”.

[NaOH]

This thread got me looking. Have you seen the 2022 corvette. Dang, that thing is pretty.

For real. I've still only seen a few on the road, and it's always an event when I do.

[F0017S0]

F550 Super Duty. Not a sports car but no one will mess with you in that tank.

[legobikes]

This thread is fun.

I was met with disapproval on these forums when I floated the idea of buying a used luxury car, and then I bought an even older luxury car for a little less cash and I'm so happy I did. It just happened to fit my exact criteria; one of the smoothest, quietest cars with one of the best sound systems, v8, doesn't look flashy, and stone cold reliable unlike the Germans. I'm enjoying the heck out of this 17 year old, $10k car. It makes all road trips better because it's so hushed compared to just about everything else. 50 mph feels the same as 100 mph. No hyperbole. So, an object can also be (or contribute to) an experience.

Then again, an 80k car seems like a shock of excess.