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Discuss Latest WCI Blog Post: What’s the Best Age to Take Social Security?

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  • Larry Ragman
    replied
    BMAC, no age limit but nominally you have to accrue enough credits. You are probably already there. See https://www.investopedia.com/persona...benefits-work/

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  • Bmac
    replied
    I am 3 years older than my spouse. We have both passed the SS second bend point. For medical reasons I might not even reach 62. I would say in our situation my spouse should clearly wait until 70 while I claim early or my spouse gets survivor benefits until turning 70. Does anyone know if there is a minimum age at which one dies to qualify for survivor benefits (not the age of the survivor to start receiving)? Sorry for the morbid post.

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  • Tim
    replied
    “However, if you change your mind 12 months or more after you became entitled to retirement benefits, you cannot withdraw your application.”

    Unlimited time period would be fantastic!

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  • Lordosis
    replied
    Say you take it at 62 and collect until you are 70. Would you consider repaying all the money you had collected up until age 70 so that you could have a higher payment going forward?

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  • Larry Ragman
    commented on 's reply
    Tim, my point was that Piper wrote a summary on the Oblivious Investor in which he specifically tried to cut through endless do loops with Monte Carlo simulations. His conclusion regarding the lower earning spouse timing was that it just didn’t matter very much. Higher earning spouse claims at 70 so either he or she lives longest and thus has highest possible benefit, or dies and surviving spouse inherits that highest benefit. The lower earning spouse will get something very close to half of the higher earning spouse regardless while higher earning spouse lives. It would be more if he or she waited, sure, but we are talking a few thousand a year. Doesn’t move the needle.

  • Cubicle
    replied
    I like the sticky feature. Regarding posting the entire article, I say go with a "snippet". If I like the appetizer, I'll click to the main course.

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  • Tim
    replied
    Larry Ragman
    I pointed the link to Piper’s SS site. Your comment about whenever convenient is the emotional choice. The wife just retired. Wait till FRA? Delay some or all? She is locked into a smaller benefit until YOURS truly passes. It’s in my benefit for her to delay if I’m still around. She wins as long as I delay till 70. The magic age is 85. What’s holding me back is my MIL that’s pushing mid 90’s. The calculator says “claim”!
    But I plan to be around until 90. It’s just math and emotions. Not easy choices. At least finances aren’t pressing, that’s why I don’t work!

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  • Tim
    replied
    The original intent of the linkage was that WCI had two completely separate platforms: blog and forum. Synergy linking was thought to be beneficial from content and comments. One observation, the audience and comments from my observation are “different”. Same article and two discussion streams for two different audiences probably is the way to go. The adding the sticky for a few days is cool. The release let’s it fade and take its separate paths. Don’t see any benefits attempting to move comments back and forth.

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  • Lordosis
    commented on 's reply
    I think a link would be sufficient. Any comments from the author would be welcome.

  • The White Coat Investor
    commented on 's reply
    I'm trying to find a middle ground between just the title and the whole post. Might add the posts from POF, PIMD, and TPP too.

  • Larry Ragman
    commented on 's reply
    Mike Piper has done a lot of work to help think through SS claiming strategies. For the married among us, it simplifies to the higher earning spouse delaying until 70 as longevity insurance and a survivor benefit, and the lower earning spouse taking SS whenever convenient but probably once stop working. As I said, this is a gross simplification, but go to his blog, the Oblivious Investor and you can read why.

  • Lordosis
    replied
    I think this is a good idea. I do not think it is necessary to copy the whole post in here but whatever.

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  • The White Coat Investor
    replied
    So someone asked for me to link the blog and forum together better. I think this is probably as good as it gets without major software challenges. Let me know if you guys like the feature. It'll be stickied automatically for two days after the post runs then unstickied automatically. They can be moved into the appropriate forum if needed, but will all post in general to start with.

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  • Lithium
    replied
    It is best to delay SS as long as possible but only IF you account for that higher future income and how it allows you to take more risk with your the rest of your investable assets.

    I was stumped for years about how to do this in any quantifiable way, but I think I've come up with a decent strategy:
    I have gone to ssa.tools to calculate my PIA based on my accumulated earnings to date. I assume this is what I will get as an annuity at age 70 (presuming this will be FRA for me with changes in the program in future decades).
    Convert this to a present value of future annuity for 30 years.
    Treat this as a TIPS fund in my asset allocation.

    I did a similar exercise for my defined benefit plan (but treated it as a corporate bond).

    After I did this, I felt like my portfolio was much heavier in fixed income than it should be. I haven't made any changes yet, but at the end of the month if I haven't changed my mind I will probably go more aggressive with equities.

    Leave a comment:


  • Tim
    replied
    Compliments to Dr. David Graham. Please do not take any comments negatively. The exercise is excellent in that it shows the combination of a Roth, IRA, SS and taxes.
    One little nitpick. The health insurance between 62 and 65 will be a little bubble in the expenses. The graphical presentations are perfect illustrations that show the concepts. For those in the accumulation stage, it was an excellent presentation of the three concepts:
    • Delay social security as long as you can
    • Tax efficient withdrawals
    • Tax impacts
    For those a little farther, married and when to take a primary and secondary social security and play in the taxes are emotional as well as mathematical. The problem is similar to sequence risk. It's basically a one time choice. Claim early on the spouse or delay? The trick is survivor benefits for the spouse upon ones death. Every year you survive past 85 or so you lost money. Like everything, the choices end up emotional.

    Not to steal the thunder, but Mike Piper has some additional reading and tools. https://opensocialsecurity.com/
    I would simply suggest everyone pick out a planning too and run it through about 90 or so. No need to be concerned about the detail, just get used to the three concepts covered in the article. It can't hurt you. The added value is that it is transferable (parents, spouse, siblings, and children). The numbers change but the concepts are the same.

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