Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

elder law

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #16
    Parents can gift their children about 15k per person per year.  So parents can gift their kids 60k without any kind of paperwork per year.  Assuming kids are well off and have a history of being trustworthy, this can be done yearly until a good chunk of the estate is gifted.

    Comment


    • #17




      I am sorry that I did not clarify. I should do a better job editing when I post at night after a long week. Parkinson’s is covered by Medicare for treatment itself, but Medicare will not pay for in-home care for Parkinson’s if the person does not want to go into assisted living. The first book I linked, Sstate Planning Is Dead, discuss this this and much better detail than I could.

      “Medicare does offer assistance for individuals with Parkinson’s. Unfortunately in the non-medical realm the program provides almost no help. Medicare will not pay for personal care at home, in assisted living, or in adult day care. Medicare does not provide for assistance with the activities of daily living with the exception being when they are provided in a nursing home, and Medicare’s nursing home benefit is limited to partial coverage for a maximum of 100 days. Medicare does offer a home care benefit. However, this is for home health care, not for personal care at home.”
      https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.payingforseniorcare.com/parkinsons/financial-assistance.html%3ftmpl=amp
      Click to expand...


      This is true for any disease not just Parkinson's.  Medicare only pays for "skilled" care, physical therapy etc.

      Comment


      • #18




        Parents can gift their children about 15k per person per year.  So parents can gift their kids 60k without any kind of paperwork per year.  Assuming kids are well off and have a history of being trustworthy, this can be done yearly until a good chunk of the estate is gifted.
        Click to expand...


        Unless the children's parents are divorced and remarry, it comes to only $30K per year ( unless I am missing something, or you are talking about married kids).

        You need to file paperwork so that you still keep the $5M lifetime exemption intact. Otherwise you will erode into that. Neither you nor your children need to pay any taxes on the 15K per person gift.

         

        Comment


        • #19







          Parents can gift their children about 15k per person per year.  So parents can gift their kids 60k without any kind of paperwork per year.  Assuming kids are well off and have a history of being trustworthy, this can be done yearly until a good chunk of the estate is gifted.
          Click to expand…


          Unless the children’s parents are divorced and remarry, it comes to only $30K per year ( unless I am missing something, or you are talking about married kids).

          You need to file paperwork so that you still keep the $5M lifetime exemption intact. Otherwise you will erode into that. Neither you nor your children need to pay any taxes on the 15K per person gift.

           
          Click to expand...


          I’m talking about married kids.  You can gift 15k to as many people as you want per year without any paperwork.  So parent 1–>15k each to son and daughter in law,  parent 2-> 15k each to son and daughter in law for 60k.

          Comment


          • #20
            Buying her a house close to a family member is a wonderful thing to do.
            From the Medicaid standpoint, titling it in your name would be appropriate, not in her name. If you put it in her name, they would want to extract the funds needed.
            Some nursing homes serve private and a limited number of Medicaid beds with different rates.
            Buying the home for her transition or donating it to the state is your choice. Paying a higher rate is your choice as well.
            It’s not simply stiffing creditors if you simply want to recover funds or structure assets to conserve both your and her assets.

            Comment


            • #21




              They are probably referring to what are known as a Medicaid Asset Protection Trust (MAPT) and other AKAs. It is an irrevocable trust with very specific provisions that meet Medicaid requirements.

              Mom needs to be comfortable with total and irrevocable loss of control and totally trusts the trustee(s).

              As pointed out there is a five (5) year look back period from Medicaid application...
              Click to expand...


              Q-school, I can’t improve on spiritrider’s input as regards the technique, but I do think there are some other considerations. No, not the morality of doing it. As I understand the rules, you won’t be stiffing anyone by the time she starts incurring these expenses. This is all about getting Medicaid to pay end of life expenses, right? Aside from getting the timing and planning right, here is my practical concern: quality of care in places or by nursing firms for a direct entry on Medicaid. We learned on looking into it for my MIL before she died that many of the better skilled nursing care facilities will bill privately until assets are exhausted, and then shift to Medicaid while keeping the person in the same care. But these same facilities had limited space available for someone coming in in Medicaid as first payer. We had only just started to look into at home nursing, but the impression I developed is that you got what you paid for. Now, as a practical matter, you and siblings could probably buy her into a decent place and then stop paying the bills to force the shift to Medicaid. But really, would you do that? My guess is that you would keep paying the bills, at least with the money she left in trust.

              Comment


              • #22




                There is a way to move assets to be able to have your parent eligible for both Medicare and Medicaid, so that you don’t get stuck with paying OOP.  There are several conditions like Parkinsons that is not covered by Medicare, and you may need Medicaid to pick up the costs.  If the parent doesn’t have secondary insurance, the 20% Medicare doesn’t cover can add up as well.

                A really great book that discusses some of these issues, including what happens when you DON’T die (most wills only pertain to death, and there are many events that aren’t covered under a basic will) is :

                https://www.amazon.com/Estate-Planning-Dead-Protection-Consumers/dp/1975780752/ref=asap_bc?ie=UTF8

                The author uses many possible scenarios and explains how estate planning in the legal field is outdated and can leave you relying upon probate or having assets seized.

                I also recommend this book.

                 
                Click to expand...


                Geriatrics here and a nursing home medical director- this is categorically false.  Parkinson's treatment is covered by medicare. All of medicare requires paying 20% copay unless you have a supplemental or medicare advantage plan.  No long term care nursing homes are paid by medicare, that is Medicaid which is what the OP is talking about.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Long Term Care (LTC) planning is the hard part as it's expensive in the private sector and worthy to get income levels low enough to qualify for county level IHSS assistance.  That's a whole lot difference than medicaid supported nursing home beds.  If rest of country is anything like San Diego or Bay Area, the medicaid beds are Motel 6 level facilities that there's no way I'd have my family in those by any means.

                  Fortunately, parents understand we'd love to have them spend their moneys now without inheritance to save us the trouble of estate handling---die broke.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    I 100% agree with your sentiments. Helping when you are able it the right thing to do. The question easily becomes a family issue at somepoint very easily.

                    Working and being frugal gives "family" the impression that you are "rich". Nursing home care can easily hit $10k per month, which for three years is $360k per person. Planning for your own my be $720k, now add MIL & FIL for $720k and another very close aunt for $360k, and a BroIL for another $360k that is paralyzed by stroke, had cancer and a heart attack. That's $2.5m before you start looking at your own retirement needs. Seven kids in spouses family and 5 kids in mine. Each sibling may be looking at their own needs and that of their own families and the natural attitude is "they can afford it." Throw in a "special needs grand child" and its a mess.

                    Unfortunately, life doesn't happen in an orderly fashion and simply having a plan to "pay your share" is viewed as "selfish". It is difficult to put you spouse at risk when the numbers get so large. We faced the issue with four so far, two have passed with two remaining. My wife is still employed, but how much is enough for "us"? At some point I se us drawing the line and not kicking in on the emotions.

                    Just don't want to be broke before my wife and I have departed.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      All of the above make a good argument for LTC insurance.   My mother bought a policy around 25 years ago.  I tried to talk her out of it.  She got it anyway, because she "didn't want the children to have to be conflicted over whether to pay for a nursing home".   It turns out to have been a wise decision, as she is now collecting for her home aides.   She will have to collect on the policy for 2-3  years in order to break even on the opportunity cost of the policy.

                      She was hospitalized twice after falls.  Each time, she went from the hospital to a nursing home.  The SNF was very nice.  A bit depressing, to be sure, but mom had a private room, good food ( we ate there on more than one occasion), excellent physical therapy, and activities.  Medicare pays for 21 days in a SNF every 12 months.  interestingly, my mother was discharged at exactly 21 days both times, which was more or less when she was ready to go.

                       

                      Comment

                      Working...
                      X