Discuss Latest WCI Blog Post: The Rise of Dr. Oz and How He Made So Much Stinkin’ Money

[MPMD]

Regarding #2: Have you ever been sick in the hospital? When you’re scared it’s comforting to hear that kind of stuff. Regarding #3: if I didn’t know anything about either candidate, I would probably vote for the physician over the hedge fund manager.

regarding #2: yes, and i would probably hope that a doctor would talk to me instead of performing

regarding #3: i would not really call Oz a doctor at this point

[MPMD]

The disdain here is interesting. 5 pages in and the only thing I’ve learned is that he sells snake oil and everyone hates him, but no one has actually watches his show. Does anyone have an example of a recommendation he made or product he sold that was legit quackery? Or is this all hearsay…

this has been endlessly tackled both in the press and in peer-reviewed journals.

your post strikes me as not being in good faith, it is so easy to find examples of his quackery.

we have disdain for Oz because he has violated the oaths and boundaries of our profession and hawks pseudoscience to vulnerable people.

that's not an alternate way of doing our job, it's the antithesis of our job.

and the fact that he has a credible shot at being a Senator is a national disgrace.

[fatlittlepig]

this has been endlessly tackled both in the press and in peer-reviewed journals.

your post strikes me as not being in good faith, it is so easy to find examples of his quackery.

we have disdain for Oz because he has violated the oaths and boundaries of our profession and hawks pseudoscience to vulnerable people.

that's not an alternate way of doing our job, it's the antithesis of our job.

and the fact that he has a credible shot at being a Senator is a national disgrace.

So have you watched the show

[fatlittlepig]

If he did recommend this, it may be more so because of his ideological leanings & slavish/cultist devotion to #45 more than any medical reason.

That's still a horrible reason for doing it, don't get me wrong. Critical thinking skills are sorely lacking - even in some supposedly educated people.

Actually early on when we lacked treatments many were using hydroxychloroquine, azithromycin. I wouldn’t automatically chalk this up to politics.

[fatlittlepig]

regarding #2: yes, and i would probably hope that a doctor would talk to me instead of performing

regarding #3: i would not really call Oz a doctor at this point

So a retired CV surgeon is no longer a doctor because you don’t like what he did after he retired.

[bovie]

Actually early on when we lacked treatments many were using hydroxychloroquine, azithromycin. I wouldn’t automatically chalk this up to politics.

Not even just politics (which of course it became)—in March 2020, there was a signal that this may be helpful in treating Covid. Was very early days.

So an argument could easily be made that this was a recommendation not only in good faith, but within the bounds of reasonable medical advice.

Turned out not to be the case of course, but nonetheless a very bad example to hold up in support of his public flogging and eternal damnation.

Hindsight is 20/20. Judging the past through the lens of the present is fraught with problems.

[fatlittlepig]

Not even just politics (which of course it became)—in March 2020, there was a signal that this may be helpful in treating Covid. Was very early days.

So an argument could easily be made that this was a recommendation not only in good faith, but within the bounds of reasonable medical advice.

Turned out not to be the case of course, but nonetheless a very bad example to hold up in support of his public flogging and eternal damnation.

Hindsight is 20/20. Judging the past through the lens of the present is fraught with problems.

Well said. Well said.

[Tim]

Did not realize BSB were still a thing

Yeah. 52 dates and up to $500 per ticket. Go figure. Funny to see every word singing along in the OR I have been told. An older attending started singing along. Confessed he took his daughters to a concert. “I did it my way” never changes. Still raking. Not the first or the last. Geez.😷
It is still selling.

[pierre]

this has been endlessly tackled both in the press and in peer-reviewed journals.

your post strikes me as not being in good faith, it is so easy to find examples of his quackery.

we have disdain for Oz because he has violated the oaths and boundaries of our profession and hawks pseudoscience to vulnerable people.

that's not an alternate way of doing our job, it's the antithesis of our job.

and the fact that he has a credible shot at being a Senator is a national disgrace.

I checked out your links. Is the whole of the scientific community against the hosts of The Doctors too? (My questions are not in bad faith, I basically live under a WCI/ESPN rock and don’t care enough to ask Dr Google. But I do enjoy the discussion here).

I agree that stuff is weird. Can you explain to me how asking people to look at their own poop is causing them actual harm? Don’t you ask at least one pt/shift about their poop? People here are implying that he’s killing people, which so far I haven’t seen any evidence of.

Giving people what they want is hardly the antithesis of our profession, especially when it seems that all his claims have about a 0% chance of causing harm to a patient (except for maybe in their pocket book).

[Kamban]

OK, time for me to jump in. People are just attacking him because some press has called him a quack.

There are many eastern medicines that were / are considered a quack because they did not go through the FDA process. Some may indeed be inactive but there are many that now the western medicine grudgingly accept as beneficial. Things like turmeric as anti inflammatory substance. Acupuncture for pain relief. Even Yoga was dismissed as numbo jumbo and before that meditation was East Asian quackery. Now all are mainstream. So hold your judgements on alternative medicine. When an Aussie doc blamed bacteria for causing gastric ulcers and even going on to stomach cancers and lymphoma, physicians laughed at him. He was proved right and won the Nobel prize.

Hydroxychloroquine was shown in labs to decrease viral load. And at that time there was no treatment for COVID and people, including physicians, were dying like flies. So any treatment or preventive measure was better than doing nothing and contracting the deadly virus. Now everyone has become a Monday morning quarterback and passing judgement but where were they early in the course. We were overproducing ventilators and putting everyone on them and killing them in the process. So do I call those pulmonologists and intensivits quacks?

And for people who think that if Dr. Oz stops his misinformation, things will be fine and people will not die, I have info for you. Go to any Costco and you will see row after row of herbals and supplements with outlandish claims and people buying them. So do we stop going to Costco because they sell unproven therapies?.

And as long as Dr. Oz does his surgery well and treats patients directly under his care with the established standard of care, I don't care what he says on TV. If you don't like it, stop watching ( but I bet you don't watch anyway). I bet more than 90% of what he says is general promotion of healthy eating, exercise and so on. Who knows, his producers would want him to mention those coffee bean extract and other stuff so that they can get advertisers, the money comes in to produce the show and Dr. Oz and the producers get paid. I don't blame them.

He has made his money and might become a politician. OTOH we will still be minions toiling away forever under the thumb of the admins and the insurance personnel so that we can earn our crumbs. And hurl stones at Dr. Oz.

[Savedfpdoc]

OK, time for me to jump in. People are just attacking him because some press has called him a quack.

There are many eastern medicines that were / are considered a quack because they did not go through the FDA process. Some may indeed be inactive but there are many that now the western medicine grudgingly accept as beneficial. Things like turmeric as anti inflammatory substance. Acupuncture for pain relief. Even Yoga was dismissed as numbo jumbo and before that meditation was East Asian quackery. Now all are mainstream. So hold your judgements on alternative medicine. When an Aussie doc blamed bacteria for causing gastric ulcers and even going on to stomach cancers and lymphoma, physicians laughed at him. He was proved right and won the Nobel prize.

Hydroxychloroquine was shown in labs to decrease viral load. And at that time there was no treatment for COVID and people, including physicians, were dying like flies. So any treatment or preventive measure was better than doing nothing and contracting the deadly viscus. Now everyone has become a Monday morning quarterback and passing judgement but where were they early in the course. We were overproducing ventilators and putting everyone on them and killing them in the process. So do I call those pulmonologists and intensivits quacks?

And for people who think that if Dr. Oz stops his misinformation, things will be fine and people will not die, I have info for you. Go to any Costco and you will see row after row of herbals and supplements with outlandish claims and people buying them. So do we stop going to Costco because they sell unproven therapies?.

And as long as Dr. Ox does his surgery well and treats patients directly under his care with the established standard of care, I don't care what he says on TV. If you don't like it, stop watching ( but I bet you don't watch anyway). I bet more than 90% of what he says is general promotion of healthy eating, exercise and so on. Who knows, his producers would want him to mention those coffee bean extract and other stuff so that they can get advertisers, the money comes in to produce the show and Dr. Oz and the producers get paid. I don't blame them.

He has made his money and might become a politician. OTOH we will still be minions toiling away forever under the thumb of the admins and the insurance personnel so that we can earn our crumbs. And hurl stones at Dr. Oz.

totally agree w you.

but Curious..this comment doesn’t get banned but I got banned a few mths ago for saying “not everyone that gets covid dies of covid”…what’s up with that?

[HikingDO]

He has made his money and might become a politician. OTOH we will still be minions toiling away forever under the thumb of the admins and the insurance personnel so that we can earn our crumbs. And hurl stones at Dr. Oz.

Exactly. Many won’t admit it, but I’m sure some of the hatred comes from jealousy.

[fatlittlepig]

This is a good example of “the narrative” and the media promoting “the narrative” being Dr Oz is a charlatan who constantly promoted dangerous and unproven treatments. That in addition to his politics and who is supporting him also plays into the narrative. I prefer to delve a bit deeper rather than blindly accept as face value.

[The White Coat Investor]

totally agree w you.

but Curious..this comment doesn’t get banned but I got banned a few mths ago for saying “not everyone that gets covid dies of covid”…what’s up with that?

Life isn't fair.

Seriously, moderation is tough so take it easy on the volunteer moderators. They're doing the best they and we're always looking for more volunteers.

[The White Coat Investor]

I thought most colleges want you to live in a dorm for the first year and do not allow a car or assign any parking space for a freshman.

I guess she's not going to "most colleges." Why would a school be allowed to dictate what you are allowed to own? That's weird. I mean, I can see how they might not let you park on campus, but that's a separate issue. At any rate, hers allows it.