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Would competitive specialties be competitive if everyone made the same?

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  • Would competitive specialties be competitive if everyone made the same?

    I am following the medicine sub-reddit recently and it is so so many people wanting to leave their current specialty for ortho/neuro sx, Derm, Ophtho etc.

    To be honest when students ask me what they should go into I say Derm. Not because its interesting but solely bc of income::work/stress ratio. like if gen surgery was paid equal to vascular or CT sx... would people LOVE gen surgery?

    Are these people not satisfied in their work truly? or do you just want more $$$ for less work. Ive read so many posts about people dying to be dermatologist.
    Do all these people truly dream of being a dermatologist?

  • #2
    more money less work.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Bdoc View Post
      I am following the medicine sub-reddit recently and it is so so many people wanting to leave their current specialty for ortho/neuro sx, Derm, Ophtho etc.

      To be honest when students ask me what they should go into I say Derm. Not because its interesting but solely bc of income::work/stress ratio. like if gen surgery was paid equal to vascular or CT sx... would people LOVE gen surgery?

      Are these people not satisfied in their work truly? or do you just want more $$$ for less work. Ive read so many posts about people dying to be dermatologist.
      Do all these people truly dream of being a dermatologist?
      Would you go into medicine if you made the money of a teacher(caveat, you won't have loans just so we can eliminate that rationalization of having to make a crap ton of money)?

      I mean everyone on this board obviously loves money or care about it a lot.
      Last edited by burritos; 03-24-2022, 03:31 PM.

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      • #4
        Clearly (almost) no one would go into nsg or CT etc if everyone was paid same. Gensurg not that great either. Ortho or ent or uro better. I dunno really what derm does all day lol so can't comment there.

        Longer I do this the more this is apparent. Getting called in to hospital in your 20s at 2am not too bad.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by childay View Post
          Clearly (almost) no one would go into nsg or CT etc if everyone was paid same. Gensurg not that great either. Ortho or ent or uro better. I dunno really what derm does all day lol so can't comment there.

          Longer I do this the more this is apparent. Getting called in to hospital in your 20s at 2am not too bad.
          It’s still pretty bad.

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          • #6
            Each year of training is different as well. The need for a fellowship on top adds to the investment.
            Derm might be the easiest high comp.
            Time is money too.
            Transitional/Preliminary Year 1 year
            Family Practice 3 years
            Internal Medicine 3 years
            Pediatrics 3 years
            Anesthesiology 3 years plus PGY-1 Transitional/Preliminary
            Dermatology 3 years plus PGY-1 Transitional/Preliminary
            Neurology 3 years plus PGY-1 Transitional/Preliminary
            Ophthalmology 3 years plus PGY-1 Transitional/Preliminary
            Physical Medicine 3 years plus PGY-1 Transitional/Preliminary
            Emergency Medicine 3-4 years
            Obstetrics-Gynecology 4 years
            Pathology 4 years
            Psychiatry 4 years
            Diagnostic Radiology 4 years plus PGY-1 Transitional/Preliminary
            Radiation Oncology 4 years plus PGY-1 Transitional/Preliminary
            General Surgery 5 years
            Orthopaedic Surgery 5 years (includes 1 year of general surgery)
            Otolaryngology 5 years (includes 1 year of general surgery)
            Urology 5 years (includes one year of general surgery)
            Plastic Surgery 5-6 years (includes 1 year of general surgery)
            Neurological Surgery 6 years (includes 1 year of general surgery)

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Panscan View Post
              It’s still pretty bad.
              How dare you. What people mean is you just have no idea how rough it is at 40, 50, and on nor how the physical demands of a say procedural job get progressively more exhausting over time adding to it.

              Your 20s make assumptions your 50s dont find enjoyable cashing in.

              While there is definitely a large element of liking procedures, there is a very real taxing part of the procedure itself/complications that comes with it (though again hard to truly get without years of experience) that I just dont think would be remotely interesting if the pay could be had by managing patients alone.

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              • #8
                Everybody in the world would like to make more money and work less.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by burritos View Post

                  Would you go into medicine if you made the money of a teacher(caveat, you won't have loans just so we can eliminate that rationalization of having to make a crap ton of money)?

                  I mean everyone on this board obviously loves money or care about it a lot.
                  There would have to be other concessions such as no risk of malpractice to even be a consideration. In the end, the consideration aspect would be short and the answer would easily be no.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Zaphod View Post

                    How dare you. What people mean is you just have no idea how rough it is at 40, 50, and on nor how the physical demands of a say procedural job get progressively more exhausting over time adding to it.

                    Your 20s make assumptions your 50s dont find enjoyable cashing in.

                    While there is definitely a large element of liking procedures, there is a very real taxing part of the procedure itself/complications that comes with it (though again hard to truly get without years of experience) that I just dont think would be remotely interesting if the pay could be had by managing patients alone.
                    I am already thinking how will I do these long operations after 10-15 years. So far, so good. but human body ages, some people age later , but we all do).
                    Knowing what I know now, just from financial perspective, I would not have done a surgical specialty ( unless you are in a high paying branch like neurosurgery ,Ortho, plastics, peds )
                    I am in academics , barring a few , everyone is trying to get admin positions after 10 years or so .

                    I love doing operations and I hope I can carry at least till 60 or so. I am just saying about specialty choice from financial perspective .

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by childay View Post

                      Longer I do this the more this is apparent. Getting called in to hospital in your 20s at 2am not too bad.
                      In my opinion, getting called into the hospital at 2am at any age is pretty bad.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by uksho View Post

                        I am already thinking how will I do these long operations after 10-15 years. So far, so good. but human body ages, some people age later , but we all do).
                        Knowing what I know now, just from financial perspective, I would not have done a surgical specialty ( unless you are in a high paying branch like neurosurgery ,Ortho, plastics, peds )
                        I am in academics , barring a few , everyone is trying to get admin positions after 10 years or so .

                        I love doing operations and I hope I can carry at least till 60 or so. I am just saying about specialty choice from financial perspective .
                        I wish you good health. I know an academic Ortho that kept a full load , department chair and ran residents and fellows ragged. Just because you can, doesn’t mean you should.

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                        • #13
                          Competitive specialties would be way less competitive. Flattening of salaries would definitely relieve some of the crappiness of the whole process. Of course by that i mean pay the lowest specialties more

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                          • #14
                            I never considered money. I did consider lifestyle.

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                            • #15
                              Of all the factors, I would say income potential was behind the ability to operate, interest in the specialty itself, and lifestyle. If every speciality paid equally, I think I would still be doing Ophthalmology. Maybe radiology since the remote/working from home thing sounds pretty nice.

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