Longest Lasting Cars Over 200,000 Miles

[Craigy]

I know the blog and forum has a little fascination with spending on personal vehicles so I thought this was relevant:

http://blog.iseecars.com/longest-lasting-cars-over-200000-miles/

Top 14 Longest-Lasting Vehicles*

Rank	Model	% of Cars Over 200k Miles
1	Ford Expedition	5.7%
2	Toyota Sequoia	5.6%
3	Chevrolet Suburban	4.8%
4	Toyota 4Runner	4.7%
5	GMC Yukon XL	4.2%
6	Chevrolet Tahoe	3.5%
7	GMC Yukon	3.0%
8	Toyota Avalon	2.6%
9	Toyota Tacoma	2.5%
10	Honda Accord	2.3%
10	Honda Odyssey	2.3%
11	Chevrolet Silverado 1500	2.2%
12	Ford F-150	2.1%
13	GMC Sierra 1500	2.0%
Average for All Models		1.3%

* With at least 2.0% of cars sold over 200,000 miles

Pretty interesting!  As the title says, SUVs dominate, almost all of them large full-size SUVs.  If you include full-size pickups it's more than half the list.

I recall from Millionaire Next Door that the author said millionaires tend to buy their cars by the pound, mostly stuff like big Lincolns and Mercuries.  I think if he re-wrote that today it'd be large SUVs like the Suburban, Expedition, Sequoia and pickups.  If I see a high net worth client's vehicle it tends to be along those lines.  Some drive luxury brands but it's mostly large SUVs regardless of make and model.

[pistolpete]

Interesting. Hope my Toyota Corolla can make it to 200k someday...

[retinadoc]

I find this very surprising. My strong assumption would be the list would be dominated by Japanese sedans and hatchbacks.

[jhwkr542]

The methodology concerns me a little bit because they're only looking at people selling their cars.  I'm not quite sure what to make of it, but it does add a variable that's not controlled.

[Zaphod]

My take of the above given peoples concerns is similar. It looks like people bought cars that are very expensive and have had to keep them forever. You dont see too many cheap o cars on there because people exchange them quickly because of the decreased friction of low costs. We had a tercel with over 300k miles until my sister crashed it. Really lots of cars can do it, but I suspect this is less about how reliable these cars are and more about their owners.

[The White Coat Investor]

I'll puff my chest out now about my 194K mile Sequoia.

However, there's a huge confounder here. A big SUV with 200K miles on it is less easily "totaled" by an expensive repair than a cheaper car. In short, it makes more sense to repair a car that cost $60K new than a car that cost $15K new.

For example, a 10 year old Sequoia with 200K miles on it is worth $7,236. A similar Accord is worth just $3,690 and a Sentra $2,435. Which one are you going to put a new $3-4K transmission into? Even if the car's transmission is only $3K and the truck's transmission is $5K, you're still going to do it on the truck but probably not either car.

[Zaphod]

The White Coat Investor wrote:

I’ll puff my chest out now about my 194K mile Sequoia.

However, there’s a huge confounder here. A big SUV with 200K miles on it is less easily “totaled” by an expensive repair than a cheaper car. In short, it makes more sense to repair a car that cost $60K new than a car that cost $15K new.

For example, a 10 year old Sequoia with 200K miles on it is worth $7,236. A similar Accord is worth just $3,690 and a Sentra $2,435. Which one are you going to put a new $3-4K transmission into? Even if the car’s transmission is only $3K and the truck’s transmission is $5K, you’re still going to do it on the truck but probably not either car.

Click to expand...

Another good qualifier.

[wideopenspaces]

Everything everyone has said totally makes sense but I hadn't thought about those things and definitely expected the list to be full of small Hondas and Toyotas. So interesting, thanks for posting!
Our little corolla is 10 years old next year and has just over 100k miles. Hoping we'll make it closer to 200k but now I'm wondering how realistic that is.

[ENT Doc]

I think the point of that chapter from The Millionaire Next Door was to not spend a lot on devaluing assets.  Others have commented on the flawed methodology in this ranking, so I won't beat that to death.  But let's just assume that it's accurate.  The less expensive sedans still win out here on a total cost basis.  If bought used, as TMND suggests that we do, the strategy is even more sound.  All else being equal, the sedan protects your wealth more than the SUV.

[The White Coat Investor]

ENT Doc wrote:

I think the point of that chapter from The Millionaire Next Door was to not spend a lot on devaluing assets.  Others have commented on the flawed methodology in this ranking, so I won’t beat that to death.  But let’s just assume that it’s accurate.  The less expensive sedans still win out here on a total cost basis.  If bought used, as TMND suggests that we do, the strategy is even more sound.  All else being equal, the sedan protects your wealth more than the SUV.

Click to expand...

And the SUV protects your health better.

[Kamban]

wideopenspaces wrote:

Everything everyone has said totally makes sense but I hadn’t thought about those things and definitely expected the list to be full of small Hondas and Toyotas. So interesting, thanks for posting!
Our little corolla is 10 years old next year and has just over 100k miles. Hoping we’ll make it closer to 200k but now I’m wondering how realistic that is.

Click to expand...

 

I have a Camry Hybrid and have the same problem. 10 years this year - 110K miles on it. I am sure it can reach 200K miles but one has to look at the inevitable costs of more frequent repairs on a car becoming almost worthless with each passing year versus saving that money and putting it towards a newer vehicle with better comfort and safety features.

I suspect that in 3 years I might buy a newer vehicle and use this as a spare vehicle in case the other one is temporarily out of service. Won't get rid of it completely but won't use it as a daily commute vehicle. It probably won't reach 200K miles but may be worth keeping until it dies and is not worth repairing.

 

[hightower]

My old Honda Civic had close to 200k when I traded it.  It was still running strong too.  Can't go wrong with Hondas or Toyotas if you're looking for cheap, reliable cars that last a very long time with minimal repair costs.

I know this is a little off topic, but...
I think that in the near future we'll see that electric vehicles are going to be the kings of cheap, reliable transportation that last a very long time.  They're simpler machines with fewer moving parts to wear out.  The brakes are hardly even used on them (because of regenerative, one pedal driving).  I love the simplicity of them and for the owner of that car, that should translate to cheaper cost of owning across the board, not just the obviously much cheaper "fuel."  And with the rise of solar and home batteries, fuel will likely continue to get cheaper.

The things we don't know much about them yet in terms of how long they will last are going to be the battery packs and electronic components (EVs are essentially giant computers, although most new cars are today).  But, battery technology is improving rapidly.  Solid state batteries are likely to be the king in the very near future and they will be much lighter and smaller (without the risk of fire/explosions), so the range will be insane compared to what we see today.  Batteries will eventually wear out, but the question of how quickly that will happen is still up in the air.  But, with such improved range, I don't see battery degradation as a major problem.  Plus, swapping out an old battery for a new one shouldn't be a big deal either.  I guess only time will tell though.  Its just too early to know.  But, I'm very optimistic

 

[Craigy]

Zaphod wrote:

My take of the above given peoples concerns is similar. It looks like people bought cars that are very expensive and have had to keep them forever. You dont see too many cheap o cars on there because people exchange them quickly because of the decreased friction of low costs. We had a tercel with over 300k miles until my sister crashed it. Really lots of cars can do it, but I suspect this is less about how reliable these cars are and more about their owners.

Click to expand...

You are probably right about the owner/driver bit.

Small cars in general are typically driven by younger, poorer people, who tend to be a higher risk.  We know a Civic will last forever but by the time it's well over 100k somebody's kid has wrecked it.

I don't know if I would classify a Tahoe or Expedition as "very expensive" but they are certainly double the price of an Accord.   Generally speaking, it seems like people who can afford a more expensive vehicle are better drivers in general.  It would also make one more likely to forestall replacement when replacement cost $40k vs $20k like you mention.

The White Coat Investor wrote:

I’ll puff my chest out now about my 194K mile Sequoia.

However, there’s a huge confounder here. A big SUV with 200K miles on it is less easily “totaled” by an expensive repair than a cheaper car. In short, it makes more sense to repair a car that cost $60K new than a car that cost $15K new.

For example, a 10 year old Sequoia with 200K miles on it is worth $7,236. A similar Accord is worth just $3,690 and a Sentra $2,435. Which one are you going to put a new $3-4K transmission into? Even if the car’s transmission is only $3K and the truck’s transmission is $5K, you’re still going to do it on the truck but probably not either car.

Click to expand...

I tend to concur with this, albeit on a slightly different line of reasoning.

It would be quick and easy to point to an initial higher cost being the simple reason something is harder to total later with similar mileage.  But if you look at used Mercedes, BMW, this theory goes out the window since high MSRP doesn't correlate well with survivability here given incredibly steep depreciation and cost of parts.  A ~10 year old BMW, whether it's a sedan, SUV, coupe, whatever, is pretty much going to be totaled by any accident with body damage because their value is so low.

The SUVs on that list tend to have more value at the end of the line since they offer more intrinsic value to the owner.  They are all heavy-duty, body-on-steel-ladder-frame vehicles that are inherently more survivable than lightweight unibody sedans.  They're bigger, higher, heavier so they are less likely to take damage in an impact, and they're relatively simple designs which means parts are relatively cheap.  And they're all built for stuff like towing and hauling which means a daily commute doesn't really impart much wear and tear.  All of that translates to the vehicle having a lot of life left (and being worth more) at 50k, 100k, 150k miles, vs a typical sedan which is feeling a bit less sprightly at those points.  And then like you mentioned, you're going to put the maintenance and repairs in on a valuable vehicle to keep it going rather than trading it in.

[Craigy]

jhwkr542 wrote:

The methodology concerns me a little bit because they’re only looking at people selling their cars.  I’m not quite sure what to make of it, but it does add a variable that’s not controlled.

Click to expand...

This is an interesting point but I think it is mitigated a bit when looking market-wide at millions of cars.  Virtually every car is ultimately sold second-hand (or third or 4th hand), so a snapshot of what's on the market at any given time should be a good, telling sample.

The argument against this method seems to be something like well X car is more reliable than the statistics indicate since people keep them forever and never sell them.  If a car is never sold on the market, that means it either a) has been towed directly to a scrapyard (most likely), b) has grass growing around it in someone's backyard (and thus out of service) or c) is actually being driven for millions of miles (least likely, these people literally tend to make the news, are celebrated and given a new car by the manufacturer, etc).  Also, the very fact that there are a bunch of lower mile examples of car X available on the market would negate that point.

The fact that a car shows up for sale with 200k+ miles on it means two valuable things:  1) that it's survived to 200k+ miles and 2) that's it's actually got some value at 200k+ miles and is worth listing for sale.  Most vehicles with so many miles never make it onto a used car lot because they are either literally worthless, simply worth less than the value of their parts at a junkyard or they never made it to that mileage to begin with.

[Craigy]

ENT Doc wrote:

I think the point of that chapter from The Millionaire Next Door was to not spend a lot on devaluing assets.  Others have commented on the flawed methodology in this ranking, so I won’t beat that to death.  But let’s just assume that it’s accurate.  The less expensive sedans still win out here on a total cost basis.  If bought used, as TMND suggests that we do, the strategy is even more sound.  All else being equal, the sedan protects your wealth more than the SUV.

Click to expand...

That was definitely the point.  Really not to spend a lot of money on anything at all.  But the data he mined was that millionaires (when that term meant more than it does today) tended to purchase their cars by the pound.  A scooter would probably protect your wealth even more than an SUV or sedan, but that's not what millionaires buy.  Today buying your car by the pound would probably mean you're buying a full-size SUV instead of a Oldsmobile, may Olds rest in peace.  I'll have to find my copy.

Edit, turns out you can google the whole book in about 3 seconds.  :lol:  Here's the excerpt I was thinking about.

What types of motor vehicles do millionaires drive? u.s. car manufacturers may be pleased to note that their makes account for 57.7 percent of the vehicles millionaires are driving; Japanese makes account for 23.5 percent, while European manufacturers hold 18.8 percent. What makes of cars are most popular with millionaires? The following are listed in rank order according to their respective market shares: 1. Ford (9.4 percent). The most popular models include the F-150 pickup and the Explorer sports utility vehicle. (American sports utility vehicles in general are becoming increasingly popular with the affluent.) About three in ten millionaire Ford drivers own F-150 pickups. About one in four drive Ford Explorers. Note that the F-150 pickup is the number-one vehicle sold in America. Thus, drivers of pickups have something in common with many millionaires...Almost all millionaires who own Jeeps choose the Grand Cherokee sports utility model. In fact, this model ranks first among all models owned by millionaires... [exhaustive list of old 90s cars here]

As you can see, most millionaires are driving so-called Detroit metal. Most Americans who own motor vehicles also drive Detroit metal. How then can you tell if your neighbor who is driving a Ford, a Cadillac, or a Jeep is a millionaire or not? You can't. It's not easy to judge the wealth characteristics of people by the motor vehicles they drive. An increasing number of affluent people are purchasing vehicles produced by American manufacturers, especially Buicks, Cadillacs, Chevrolets, Chryslers, Fords, Lincolns, and Oldsmobiles. This trend is related to the growing popularity of sports utility vehicles produced by Chrysler, Ford, and General Motors. What is it about Detroit metal that appeals to the wealthy? We can answer that question by reflecting on something that took place more than fifteen years ago.

After interviewing a group of ten millionaires, we walked into the parking lot of the research facility. We were very surprised to see that almost all of the millionaires we had just interviewed were driving fullsized Detroit metal, including Buicks, Fords, and Oldsmobiles. We looked at each other; one said: "These people are not into status; they buy automobiles by the pound!" It's true. Many American millionaires have a propensity to purchase full-sized automobiles that have a low cost per pound. The average per pound price for all new motor vehicles is $6.86. The full-sized Buick four-door sedan currently sells for less than $6.00 a pound; the Chevrolet Caprice, about $5.27 per pound; the Ford Crown Victoria, about $5.50; the Lincoln Town Car, less than $10.00 a pound; and the Cadillac Fleetwood, $8.26 a pound. The Ford Explorer sells for about $5.98 a pound. The most popular model among millionaires is the Jeep Grand Cherokee, which sells for $7.09 per pound.

Of course none of this necessarily means any of these cars last very long, just that they're historically chosen by millionaires.