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  • #16
    If this is a rural area I would ask for more CME money, more bonus, more everything.  I get 6k for CME a year.  at least 50k sign on etc.  This is also in the boonies "sportsman's paradise" type place.

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    • #17
      Yea, if they're desperate, you should get desperate money. But in the end a negotiation comes down to who is more willing to go with their next best choice.
      Helping those who wear the white coat get a fair shake on Wall Street since 2011

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      • #18
        I find the promise of '40 clinical hours' laughable.  If you're busy enough to generate revenue to justify a salary of that amount you are likely to work substantially more than that unless you have ownership stake in facilities, mid-levels, etc.  Just my 2 cents though.

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        • #19
          Are you the only gi in town?  The 40 clinical hours maybe 24/7 call.

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          • #20




            Yea, if they’re desperate, you should get desperate money. But in the end a negotiation comes down to who is more willing to go with their next best choice.
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            There is no next best choice for them right now. This does make them more desperate. This offer for the region is quite generous. I plan to certainly ask for a larger signing bonus, more vacation days, no bonus cap. I do not plan to ask for more base salary but rather the removal of the incentive cap.

             




            Are you the only gi in town?  The 40 clinical hours maybe 24/7 call.
            Click to expand...


            Not the only GI in town. Call will be spread thin enough for my liking.




            If this is a rural area I would ask for more CME money, more bonus, more everything.  I get 6k for CME a year.  at least 50k sign on etc.  This is also in the boonies “sportsman’s paradise” type place.
            Click to expand...


            It is totally in the boonies. Fortunately, I love the boonies. I know from experience that it is a sportsman's paradise. I plan to ask for nearly more everything except for directly increasing the guaranteed base salary which I feel is quite fair. Is it normal to feel that if I get to greedy with asking that it might ruffle some feathers? I know that it is an employed position which makes it less of a concern than if it was a partnership, but I still feel that asking for too much might get me started off on the wrong foot?

             

             

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            • #21
              I guess it depends. Do you plan to work for the hospital forever. They need you and you want them but it never hurts to ask. It sounds really good to me as is.

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              • #22
                I would say if this is in the boonies they should be giving you a stronger offer.  I don't know what going rate is for GI salary wise but don't feel bad asking for more benefits.  Guarantee the hospital CEO and CFO don't feel bad about lowballing you..

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                • #23
                  I would personally prefer a higher guarantee than anything else, its all the same to them. If its the boonies and they are having a hard time recruiting, thats a hint that their offers are not considered competitive enough clearly. I would definitely get rid of that incentive cap, its nonsense.

                  For the boonies and considering GI can usually do really well even in good locations, its not that impressive. My friends have taken one of these boonies jobs in plastics, where the average offer isnt near the GI ones i've seen ppl report and theirs was much better (450 base, 100 sign on, 25k/y student loan, 75/rvu). Many plastics in good locations are scraping by.

                  Maybe the GI guys I see are an anomaly since its from sites like these but they usually seem to do around mid 3/4 fairly normally right?

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                  • #24




                    I guess it depends. Do you plan to work for the hospital forever. They need you and you want them but it never hurts to ask. It sounds really good to me as is.
                    Click to expand...


                    I don't have any plans on leaving the area but I am well aware of the rate of job turnover especially in the beginning.




                    I would say if this is in the boonies they should be giving you a stronger offer.  I don’t know what going rate is for GI salary wise but don’t feel bad asking for more benefits.  Guarantee the hospital CEO and CFO don’t feel bad about lowballing you..
                    Click to expand...


                    This is a small enough hospital that the president went to dinner with me during my recruitment dinner. All of the people I have interacted with have seemed very genuine but I do not how quickly things can change with one signature.




                    I would personally prefer a higher guarantee than anything else, its all the same to them. If its the boonies and they are having a hard time recruiting, thats a hint that their offers are not considered competitive enough clearly. I would definitely get rid of that incentive cap, its nonsense.

                    For the boonies and considering GI can usually do really well even in good locations, its not that impressive. My friends have taken one of these boonies jobs in plastics, where the average offer isnt near the GI ones i’ve seen ppl report and theirs was much better (450 base, 100 sign on, 25k/y student loan, 75/rvu). Many plastics in good locations are scraping by.

                    Maybe the GI guys I see are an anomaly since its from sites like these but they usually seem to do around mid 3/4 fairly normally right?
                    Click to expand...


                    A GI salary of 750,000 is absolutely an anomaly. The highest I am aware of in my area is 600,000 in a 3 person private practice where they are working their tails off and they own their own endoscopy center (ASC). But I am beginning to get the sense from all of these posts that I should shoot high and see what happens. I know I have some serious leverage given the location and the inability to successfully recruit over the past several years.

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                    • #25







                      I guess it depends. Do you plan to work for the hospital forever. They need you and you want them but it never hurts to ask. It sounds really good to me as is.
                      Click to expand…


                      I don’t have any plans on leaving the area but I am well aware of the rate of job turnover especially in the beginning.




                      I would say if this is in the boonies they should be giving you a stronger offer.  I don’t know what going rate is for GI salary wise but don’t feel bad asking for more benefits.  Guarantee the hospital CEO and CFO don’t feel bad about lowballing you..
                      Click to expand…


                      This is a small enough hospital that the president went to dinner with me during my recruitment dinner. All of the people I have interacted with have seemed very genuine but I do not how quickly things can change with one signature.




                      I would personally prefer a higher guarantee than anything else, its all the same to them. If its the boonies and they are having a hard time recruiting, thats a hint that their offers are not considered competitive enough clearly. I would definitely get rid of that incentive cap, its nonsense.

                      For the boonies and considering GI can usually do really well even in good locations, its not that impressive. My friends have taken one of these boonies jobs in plastics, where the average offer isnt near the GI ones i’ve seen ppl report and theirs was much better (450 base, 100 sign on, 25k/y student loan, 75/rvu). Many plastics in good locations are scraping by.

                      Maybe the GI guys I see are an anomaly since its from sites like these but they usually seem to do around mid 3/4 fairly normally right?
                      Click to expand…


                      A GI salary of 750,000 is absolutely an anomaly. The highest I am aware of in my area is 600,000 in a 3 person private practice where they are working their tails off and they own their own endoscopy center (ASC). But I am beginning to get the sense from all of these posts that I should shoot high and see what happens. I know I have some serious leverage given the location and the inability to successfully recruit over the past several years.
                      Click to expand...


                      Sorry, I meant 3-400k, pretty sure 750 is decent anywhere in any field.

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                      • #26
                        When I interviewed for a rural West Virginia hospital employed GI position about 5 years ago, they were offering 550k base guaranteed for 3 years, 50k sign on, and lucrative vacation (can't remember how much). Hope this helps and good luck!

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                        • #27




                          I have created a new user name to remain anonymous. I would love to hear some input on the initial offer of employment that I received yesterday. This offer is as a clinical gastroenterologist at a small hospital (part of larger system) in the Northeast.

                          The details are:

                          -400,000 base salary guaranteed for 5 years

                          -potential for 78,000 bonus based on 1,500 wRVU above 6500 (capped at a total of 8000 wRVU so no more than 78,000 can be made)

                          -25,000 sign on bonus

                          -4 weeks vacation

                          -1 week CME/travel with 1,500 to spend

                          -40 clinical hours

                          My first thoughts are that the base salary and guaranteed 5 year period are quite fair. I think the threshold to start receiving bonus at 6500 wRVU is fair as I understand the national average for GI to be 7500 wRVU. I am interested in possibly removing the cap on the bonus so that If I were to pass 8000 wRVU that additional bonus money could be made. I would also consider asking for 50,000 at time of signing to pay off some of my student loans (have 150,000).

                          I am interested to hear any thoughts/questions from the great people on this forum.

                           

                          Thanks,

                          “Mike”

                           
                          Click to expand...


                          Update to the thread that I started. I asked for more across the board and here is the counter offer that I received:

                           

                          Initial offer: 400,000 for 5 years guaranteed-------------I asked for 475,000-------their counter offer 437,500.

                          4 weeks vacation-----------I asked for 5 weeks------------they stayed at 4 weeks (I don't think they will budge on this)

                          (error in initial post) they offered 2,500-------------I asked for 3,500-----------they offered 3,000

                          25,000 signing bonus----------I asked for 50,000----------they stayed at 25,000 but even better they offered to pay off my 150,000 in student loans over 4 years at 37,500 per year. (I have asked them to pay my lender directly and they are looking into this).

                           

                          Finally, while they did increase the guaranteed salary from 400,000 to 437,500, they increased the threshold to receive a bonus incentive from 6500 to 7300 wRVUs at 52.00 per wRVU. So they increased the threshold which is equivalent to 41,600 (52 x 800 wRVU) and added 37,500 guaranteed which I see as a fair trade. I would have likely received that bonus anyways on incentive work but it is now guaranteed which is a win. They initially placed a earnings cap on the wRVUs which they have now removed as well.

                           

                          I am pretty happy with their counter offer. They really want/need me and the recruiter alluded to these offers as "ongoing conversation," and to tell them what I want because they will do what they can to get me there. I plan to ask for 450,000 (12, 500 more) and to lower the threshold for bonuses to 7000 (300 x 52 dollars/rvu=15,600) for a total potential swing of 28,100.

                          What do people think of their counter and my planned counter?

                          "Mike"

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                          • #28
                            Congrats.

                            The 37.5k is income so count it as such (but has a ending date so maybe get it guaranteed after). Try not to make your RVU bonus so hard to reach without realizing it if you think you might use it.

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                            • #29
                              The real question is do they know you are a WCI reader and plan to use this salary to reach FIRE in 5 years?   
                              An alt-brown look at medicine, money, faith, & family
                              www.RogueDadMD.com

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                              • #30




                                The real question is do they know you are a WCI reader and plan to use this salary to reach FIRE in 5 years?   ?
                                Click to expand...


                                They do not know what is about to hit them. Haha. On a serious note, I plan to have the ability to retire in 15 years if I so please. That would put me at 48 yo with (hopefully) 25-30 years life of prosperity.

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