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Net Worth Data- for those who like to keep score...

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  • Complete_newbie
    replied








    There is no way $1.2M is 1%. It doesn’t pass the smell test. I think $10M is closer to reality than $1M but have no idea what the true number is 
    Click to expand…


    I would say that the $10M does not pass the smell test. If the US population is 350M and if we assume there are 100M households, then there should be 1M households having $10M. With almost half the population not even having a saving of $1000 I doubt that there are 1M households having that much money.

    If you take into account market gains since 2012 I think that the $1.2M is now around $3M. I think the IRS method is more believable than the Fed method.
    Click to expand…


    http://www.cleveland.com/business/index.ssf/2016/03/us_millionaires_club_adds_3000.html

    At the end of this article it says there are 1.2M households worth 5-25M. Says 10% of households over 1M, not including house.
    Click to expand...


    Totally can see that. Close to where I live thats like every other household, and yet its not a fancy area. They are business owners though mostly.

    Leave a comment:


  • ENT Doc
    replied





    Are they saying that one in ten households is a millionaire? Seems like a lot. 
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    That’s what this study shows, too. 10.8 Million households in the US with a million or more in investable assets, or more than 1 in 10.
    Click to expand...


    Apparently there are many millionaires next door.

    Leave a comment:


  • Raydoc
    replied
    Any thoughts on why the bottom 10th percentile has dropped by half in only 3 years? I haven't seen this data before, perhaps there are wild swings observed at the bottom commonly.

    Leave a comment:


  • FIREshrink
    replied





    There is no way $1.2M is 1%. It doesn’t pass the smell test. I think $10M is closer to reality than $1M but have no idea what the true number is 
    Click to expand…


    I would say that the $10M does not pass the smell test. If the US population is 350M and if we assume there are 100M households, then there should be 1M households having $10M. With almost half the population not even having a saving of $1000 I doubt that there are 1M households having that much money.

    If you take into account market gains since 2012 I think that the $1.2M is now around $3M. I think the IRS method is more believable than the Fed method.
    Click to expand...


    Clearly wealth distribution does not follow a normed curve. Half of all Americans can't find $1000 in an emergency, but that says nothing about how the 1% live. Wealth grows exponentially at the top. I don't know what the figure is, but $10M wouldn't shock me.

    Leave a comment:


  • PhysicianOnFIRE
    replied


    Are they saying that one in ten households is a millionaire? Seems like a lot.
    Click to expand...


    That's what this study shows, too. 10.8 Million households in the US with a million or more in investable assets, or more than 1 in 10.

    Leave a comment:


  • Zaphod
    replied





    There is no way $1.2M is 1%. It doesn’t pass the smell test. I think $10M is closer to reality than $1M but have no idea what the true number is 
    Click to expand…


    I would say that the $10M does not pass the smell test. If the US population is 350M and if we assume there are 100M households, then there should be 1M households having $10M. With almost half the population not even having a saving of $1000 I doubt that there are 1M households having that much money.

    If you take into account market gains since 2012 I think that the $1.2M is now around $3M. I think the IRS method is more believable than the Fed method.
    Click to expand...


    http://www.cleveland.com/business/index.ssf/2016/03/us_millionaires_club_adds_3000.html

    At the end of this article it says there are 1.2M households worth 5-25M. Says 10% of households over 1M, not including house.

    Leave a comment:


  • Kamban
    replied


    There is no way $1.2M is 1%. It doesn’t pass the smell test. I think $10M is closer to reality than $1M but have no idea what the true number is
    Click to expand...


    I would say that the $10M does not pass the smell test. If the US population is 350M and if we assume there are 100M households, then there should be 1M households having $10M. With almost half the population not even having a saving of $1000 I doubt that there are 1M households having that much money.

    If you take into account market gains since 2012 I think that the $1.2M is now around $3M. I think the IRS method is more believable than the Fed method.

    Leave a comment:


  • FIREshrink
    replied
    There is no way $1.2M is 1%. It doesn't pass the smell test. I think $10M is closer to reality than $1M but have no idea what the true number is, and it probably doesn't matter until there are pitchforks outside the gate, and at that point if you have "only" $1M it's not going to save your hide from the proletariat who want to hang the landlord class.

    Leave a comment:


  • Craigy
    replied




    Net worth is difficult to calculate

    If you look at this blog the requirement to get into the top 1% net worth was 1.2M and even the 2014 update did not change that much. I doubt that it has become $10M today.

    http://www2.ucsc.edu/whorulesamerica/power/investment_manager.html
    Click to expand...


    I skimmed it but this bit compares the two methods briefly:
    A New York Times article (Economix, 1/17/12) agrees that the threshold for being in the top 1 per cent in household income is about $380k but states that, based on Fed data, the 1% threshold for net worth is $8.4M. The figure I use is around $1.5M and comes from the IRS. The Fed uses a simple formula based on assets and liabilities at a broad level of analysis with little detail. Using Fed data, about 8% of US households have a net worth exceeding $1M and the median net worth of the top 10% of US families is $1.569M. The IRS uses the estate multiplier technique to calculate the data, a more complex measure based on tax returns, capitalization of earnings power, and other factors. The estate multiplier technique has been around for decades, is more widely used, and in the opinion of many, is the more accurate number. Where the true threshold is located is impossible to determine with accuracy, but my observations in managing money support the lower number or something close to it.

     

    Leave a comment:


  • Hatton
    replied




    Net worth is difficult to calculate

    If you look at this blog the requirement to get into the top 1% net worth was 1.2M and even the 2014 update did not change that much. I doubt that it has become $10M today.

    http://www2.ucsc.edu/whorulesamerica/power/investment_manager.html
    Click to expand...


    Yes I have seen that post before but not the update.  An awfully lot of us are 1%ers if it only takes 1.2 mill to get there.  I intuitively I feel 8-10 is more realistic. I don't know if it even matters.

    Leave a comment:


  • Kamban
    replied
    Net worth is difficult to calculate

    If you look at this blog the requirement to get into the top 1% net worth was 1.2M and even the 2014 update did not change that much. I doubt that it has become $10M today.

    http://www2.ucsc.edu/whorulesamerica/power/investment_manager.html

    Leave a comment:


  • LizOB
    replied
    75%ile under age 35- I'll take it!

    Leave a comment:


  • ITEngineer
    replied
    I track my Networth monthly but I think income is a better choice. That income should include Rents and Dividends. An extreme example, $10M in T-bills is very different from $10M in real estate providing you with inflation protected monthly income.  Of course you might have $10M in T-bills because you are about to buy a hotel.

    Leave a comment:


  • Craigy
    replied
    I don't know, $10M strikes me as awful high for the top 1%, and $1.2M for top 10%.  Are they saying that one in ten households is a millionaire?  Seems like a lot.

    Also says it excludes wealth such as pensions and social security which would seemingly make it more of a stretch.  Relatively small sample size too.

    Then again, $1.2M isn't really a lot.  That could be owning a home and putting a reasonable amount of money into retirement.  There's definitely a lot more people out there with money than most people realize.

    Leave a comment:


  • Hatton
    replied
    The income is easy enough to achieve but maintaining it year after year becomes tedious.

    Leave a comment:

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