?Hire a fee-based FA temporarily for less than fee-only

[The White Coat Investor]

Snag75 wrote:

jfoxcpacfp wrote:

I wish I could justify paying $5K+ on advice, but I just can’t.

 

Click to expand...

Then you'll need to learn how to do this yourself. It'll take more than a day or two, but less than a few months. Just keep asking questions. You'll figure this out. It's not that hard. Let's start with some basics:

What is your annual income?

What is your current net worth? List all of your assets such as home equity, bank accounts, retirement accounts, and other investments. Then list all of your debts with their amounts and interest rates. Subtract debts from assets.

How much do you expect to save in the next year? What accounts will that money go into?

How much is in each of your accounts now?

What investments do you currently own in each account now?

What investments are available in your employer provided accounts that you will keep long term?

What insurance policies do you have in place now?

Once you can answer all of those questions, the battle is already half won. I'm serious. List out the answers in this thread and you'll get some very useful advice.

[Snag75]

The White Coat Investor wrote:

I must have missed the other thread that’s got everyone fired up. I’m just going off what I’m reading here.

$1500 is a heck of a deal for financial advice. As long as the advice is good, I’d be very happy to pay that price for it if I were you. So let’s try to determine whether the advice is good, because there is no fee low enough to make up for bad advice. Not enough info in your post though, so I’ll go back to the one you linked to. Here’s what it says:

With my old advisor I ended up with my only post-tax investment via old Whole Life and VUL (don’t ask, bad advice when I was starting out and naive). My new FA agrees with the costs of the VUL being a poor investment choice (as well as some other investment choices I had given some changes in the market) and we plan to collapse as soon as it makes sense. I have moved my IRA account to his firm where they have me in a particular “model” (they have like 12 models, based on time to retirement, etc), and apparently make adjustments to each model based on their algorithms and what’s going on in the market. Previous FA made no adjustments and I had some losses which he states could have been avoided. His place is a one-stop shop (he has dedicated market watcher, as well as CPA and estate attny that work with him) and I thought it would be good to get advice there and have them manage the funds he has control of for a flat fee (based on % of IRA holdings) at least until I feel I have a full plan in place for the upcoming years.

So I like his plan of more active management (esp since his fees are about the same as prior), but now when it comes to back-door Roth he seems discouraging because he doesn’t want me to move the funds from IRA to solo-K, stating we wouldn’t have all the investment choices (ETFs, index funds, etc) that we do now with the open market. I just wanted a place to start putting in post-tax money finally, but he recommends using up space in my employer’s 403B instead (takes away from how much pre-tax I can put away) and HSA (which I’d planned to do too). Then he mentioned an IUL (since I’m losing life insurance when we collapse VUL and Whole), but I didn’t want to get into that stuff.

Okay, we’ve now determined you’re not getting good advice. Sorry. Even at $1500, that’s no deal. Based on your comments, you’re still a ways away from being a competent DIY investor. You can get there, of course, but it’s going to take one of three things:

1) Read a few books, keep perusing the blog, and keep asking questions on the forum until you get a written financial plan in place

https://www.whitecoatinvestor.com/best-financial-books-for-doctors/

2) Take my Fire Your Financial Advisor Course. It costs more than the books in money, but much less in time.

https://whitecoatinvestor.teachable.com/p/fire-your-financial-advisor

3) Hire an hourly rate financial to help you set up a financial plan that you can maintain on your own going forward. There are a few of those here:

https://www.whitecoatinvestor.com/financial-advisors/

The other alternative, of course, is simply to hire a competent, low-cost fee-only fiduciary financial advisor. You can find lots of those here: https://www.whitecoatinvestor.com/financial-advisors/

If you’re not sure HOW I know you’re getting bad advice, let’s walk you through it step by step:

“we plan to collapse as soon as it makes sense” It makes sense now. Making more payments doesn’t help.

“0.2% program fees for housing and managing my rollover IRA fund of <$150K” A housing fee is silly. What’s the 1% for if not for managing the rollover IRA?

“the plan is to enter all my stuff into some program he has” Programs are great but are no substitute for competence. It’s amazing I’ve gotten as far as I have without a program.

“apparently make adjustments to each model based on their algorithms and what’s going on in the market” Tactical asset allocation is a lousy idea. If you could predict the future, just put everything in what is going to do well. If you can’t, don’t try to time the market with any of the portfolio. Just doing it with a small portion is silly.

“which he states could have been avoided”. Sure, with a functioning crystal ball.

“he has dedicated market watcher” Why would you have a dedicated market watcher? The secret to good investing is to NOT watch the market.

“I like his plan of more active management” Why? Are you familiar with the data behind passive investing? Are you really willing to gamble your life savings on something with a 10-20% chance of success in the long run?

“when it comes to back-door Roth he seems discouraging because he doesn’t want me to move the funds from IRA to solo-K, stating we wouldn’t have all the investment choices (ETFs, index funds, etc) that we do now with the open market.” Nope. Bad advice. He clearly doesn’t get the Backdoor Roth IRA, nor what is available in a good i410(k). Certainly you can get everything you need for a good portfolio there.

“he recommends using up space in my employer’s 403B instead (takes away from how much pre-tax I can put away” Bad advice. In your situation, the tax-deferred 403b at work is almost certainly the correct choice rather than the Roth 403b.

“Then he mentioned an IUL.” Oh crap. It just got worse. Run, don’t walk. I’m sorry. I know he seemed nice. But when I’m talking about bad advisors, I’m talking about people like your advisor. I’m sorry, I know it’s a pain to keep changing and I know it all seems very frightening because you are still becoming financially literate, but this isn’t going to be your long term advisor so the sooner you make the break the better.

Let me know if there is anything else I can do to help. You can do this. Thousands of doctors before you have done so. Either get good advice at a fair price or learn to do it competently yourself. Those are the only two reasonable options for you.

Click to expand...

Thank you again for your thoughtful response (and finally a direct answer to my question!).  You didn't miss anything -- everyone is just fired up about suggesting that there could be a grey area with dealing with a fee-based FA who isn't 100% trustworthy.
Your points are well-taken.  Since I wrote that I actually had a conversation with him (previously were just snippets of messages) and clarified where he was coming from in mentioning IUL, as well as clarified his understanding of solo-K options -- both different from how they struck me before, but still also not what I was comfortable with (I posted an update in that same thread if you care to know the nuances) and he was fine with that, though concerned we couldn't get all steps done in time (that would be via his routes, perhaps faster doing it on my own).  In the end we realized I could probably still do a front-door so we're leaving that alone until next year.  Reasons for IUL was concerns of capital gains tax when I collapse the other 2 accounts which seems less concerning than being stuck in an IUL (he explained how you can never let it self-destrict) and he understood that too.  The thought of "when it makes sense" re: collapsing VUL was surrender fee since I'm almost at 10yrs, plus we had/have other fish to fry with sooner deadlines (turns out WL policy premium just came due so that pushed my hand work on that).

I don't really know what the 0.2% "program fee" is for, meaning I don't know if that's something I would avoid by not using AUM.  Obviously part of my education that I need to work on which I never paid attention to before.

The "program" he has sounds like some kind of calculator that shows how things will grow over time, to help predict how much in each pot one may want (my question these days is how fast do I need my post-tax pot to grow, considering it's zero now, and should I ever consider sacrificing pre-tax for it, as my income is lower and deductions higher than will probably be again.  That's the kind of "big picture" look I need to figure, as I expect to also have a tax-deferred pension coming to me, possible inheritance, etc, but I'll also be paying outright from direct earnings (i.e. no savings) for 2 kids in college on my own when in my 50s (unusual for most of your cohort I believe, despite them believing that we all should have the same strategy).  I'm curious your thoughts on sacrificing pre-tax (I think it's actually 457B, not 403B) for the Roth 457B through employer -- I'd rather create Roth elsewhere, but if it seems I need more tax-deferred savings, and I don't have extra cash to invest, then...

I have since researched about the active mgmt vs index fund (set it and forget it) preferred approach here.  Will definitely be addressing with him, and not sure how that will work.  Would at least like to know for now if his choices are NOT good for certain reasons, so I can have a better idea of what to do and how soon.

Thank you for also understanding the challenging/emotional aspects of these types of shifts.  Add to it that I don't have a lot of bandwidth to play with and have spent way too much of my very limited time just sorting out what I have so far...explaining why it's all needed to be deferred for so long.  I guess I need a short-term plan in addition to long-term plan, because I can't do it all now, but some things should happen within a certain timeline.  Right now I'm working on getting my insurance up, seeing if I need to buy more portable term, and figuring out what to do with WL cash value, as well as make plans for how 2019 contributions will happen (all pre-tax as usual, or add in some post-tax)?

[The White Coat Investor]

Snag75 wrote:

The White Coat Investor wrote:

I must have missed the other thread that’s got everyone fired up. I’m just going off what I’m reading here.

$1500 is a heck of a deal for financial advice. As long as the advice is good, I’d be very happy to pay that price for it if I were you. So let’s try to determine whether the advice is good, because there is no fee low enough to make up for bad advice. Not enough info in your post though, so I’ll go back to the one you linked to. Here’s what it says:

With my old advisor I ended up with my only post-tax investment via old Whole Life and VUL (don’t ask, bad advice when I was starting out and naive). My new FA agrees with the costs of the VUL being a poor investment choice (as well as some other investment choices I had given some changes in the market) and we plan to collapse as soon as it makes sense. I have moved my IRA account to his firm where they have me in a particular “model” (they have like 12 models, based on time to retirement, etc), and apparently make adjustments to each model based on their algorithms and what’s going on in the market. Previous FA made no adjustments and I had some losses which he states could have been avoided. His place is a one-stop shop (he has dedicated market watcher, as well as CPA and estate attny that work with him) and I thought it would be good to get advice there and have them manage the funds he has control of for a flat fee (based on % of IRA holdings) at least until I feel I have a full plan in place for the upcoming years.

So I like his plan of more active management (esp since his fees are about the same as prior), but now when it comes to back-door Roth he seems discouraging because he doesn’t want me to move the funds from IRA to solo-K, stating we wouldn’t have all the investment choices (ETFs, index funds, etc) that we do now with the open market. I just wanted a place to start putting in post-tax money finally, but he recommends using up space in my employer’s 403B instead (takes away from how much pre-tax I can put away) and HSA (which I’d planned to do too). Then he mentioned an IUL (since I’m losing life insurance when we collapse VUL and Whole), but I didn’t want to get into that stuff.

Okay, we’ve now determined you’re not getting good advice. Sorry. Even at $1500, that’s no deal. Based on your comments, you’re still a ways away from being a competent DIY investor. You can get there, of course, but it’s going to take one of three things:

1) Read a few books, keep perusing the blog, and keep asking questions on the forum until you get a written financial plan in place

https://www.whitecoatinvestor.com/best-financial-books-for-doctors/

2) Take my Fire Your Financial Advisor Course. It costs more than the books in money, but much less in time.

https://whitecoatinvestor.teachable.com/p/fire-your-financial-advisor

3) Hire an hourly rate financial to help you set up a financial plan that you can maintain on your own going forward. There are a few of those here:

https://www.whitecoatinvestor.com/financial-advisors/

The other alternative, of course, is simply to hire a competent, low-cost fee-only fiduciary financial advisor. You can find lots of those here: https://www.whitecoatinvestor.com/financial-advisors/

If you’re not sure HOW I know you’re getting bad advice, let’s walk you through it step by step:

“we plan to collapse as soon as it makes sense” It makes sense now. Making more payments doesn’t help.

“0.2% program fees for housing and managing my rollover IRA fund of <$150K” A housing fee is silly. What’s the 1% for if not for managing the rollover IRA?

“the plan is to enter all my stuff into some program he has” Programs are great but are no substitute for competence. It’s amazing I’ve gotten as far as I have without a program.

“apparently make adjustments to each model based on their algorithms and what’s going on in the market” Tactical asset allocation is a lousy idea. If you could predict the future, just put everything in what is going to do well. If you can’t, don’t try to time the market with any of the portfolio. Just doing it with a small portion is silly.

“which he states could have been avoided”. Sure, with a functioning crystal ball.

“he has dedicated market watcher” Why would you have a dedicated market watcher? The secret to good investing is to NOT watch the market.

“I like his plan of more active management” Why? Are you familiar with the data behind passive investing? Are you really willing to gamble your life savings on something with a 10-20% chance of success in the long run?

“when it comes to back-door Roth he seems discouraging because he doesn’t want me to move the funds from IRA to solo-K, stating we wouldn’t have all the investment choices (ETFs, index funds, etc) that we do now with the open market.” Nope. Bad advice. He clearly doesn’t get the Backdoor Roth IRA, nor what is available in a good i410(k). Certainly you can get everything you need for a good portfolio there.

“he recommends using up space in my employer’s 403B instead (takes away from how much pre-tax I can put away” Bad advice. In your situation, the tax-deferred 403b at work is almost certainly the correct choice rather than the Roth 403b.

“Then he mentioned an IUL.” Oh crap. It just got worse. Run, don’t walk. I’m sorry. I know he seemed nice. But when I’m talking about bad advisors, I’m talking about people like your advisor. I’m sorry, I know it’s a pain to keep changing and I know it all seems very frightening because you are still becoming financially literate, but this isn’t going to be your long term advisor so the sooner you make the break the better.

Let me know if there is anything else I can do to help. You can do this. Thousands of doctors before you have done so. Either get good advice at a fair price or learn to do it competently yourself. Those are the only two reasonable options for you.

Click to expand…

Thank you again for your thoughtful response (and finally a direct answer to my question!).  You didn’t miss anything — everyone is just fired up about suggesting that there could be a grey area with dealing with a fee-based FA who isn’t 100% trustworthy.
Your points are well-taken.  Since I wrote that I actually had a conversation with him (previously were just snippets of messages) and clarified where he was coming from in mentioning IUL, as well as clarified his understanding of solo-K options — both different from how they struck me before, but still also not what I was comfortable with (I posted an update in that same thread if you care to know the nuances) and he was fine with that, though concerned we couldn’t get all steps done in time (that would be via his routes, perhaps faster doing it on my own).  In the end we realized I could probably still do a front-door so we’re leaving that alone until next year.  Reasons for IUL was concerns of capital gains tax when I collapse the other 2 accounts which seems less concerning than being stuck in an IUL (he explained how you can never let it self-destrict) and he understood that too.  The thought of “when it makes sense” re: collapsing VUL was surrender fee since I’m almost at 10yrs, plus we had/have other fish to fry with sooner deadlines (turns out WL policy premium just came due so that pushed my hand work on that).

I don’t really know what the 0.2% “program fee” is for, meaning I don’t know if that’s something I would avoid by not using AUM.  Obviously part of my education that I need to work on which I never paid attention to before.

The “program” he has sounds like some kind of calculator that shows how things will grow over time, to help predict how much in each pot one may want (my question these days is how fast do I need my post-tax pot to grow, considering it’s zero now, and should I ever consider sacrificing pre-tax for it, as my income is lower and deductions higher than will probably be again.  That’s the kind of “big picture” look I need to figure, as I expect to also have a tax-deferred pension coming to me, possible inheritance, etc, but I’ll also be paying outright from direct earnings (i.e. no savings) for 2 kids in college on my own when in my 50s (unusual for most of your cohort I believe, despite them believing that we all should have the same strategy).  I’m curious your thoughts on sacrificing pre-tax (I think it’s actually 457B, not 403B) for the Roth 457B through employer — I’d rather create Roth elsewhere, but if it seems I need more tax-deferred savings, and I don’t have extra cash to invest, then…

I have since researched about the active mgmt vs index fund (set it and forget it) preferred approach here.  Will definitely be addressing with him, and not sure how that will work.  Would at least like to know for now if his choices are NOT good for certain reasons, so I can have a better idea of what to do and how soon.

Thank you for also understanding the challenging/emotional aspects of these types of shifts.  Add to it that I don’t have a lot of bandwidth to play with and have spent way too much of my very limited time just sorting out what I have so far…explaining why it’s all needed to be deferred for so long.  I guess I need a short-term plan in addition to long-term plan, because I can’t do it all now, but some things should happen within a certain timeline.  Right now I’m working on getting my insurance up, seeing if I need to buy more portable term, and figuring out what to do with WL cash value, as well as make plans for how 2019 contributions will happen (all pre-tax as usual, or add in some post-tax)?

Click to expand...

Just keep reading. As you do, your opinion of the quality of the advice you've been getting will continue to drop.

As a general rule, you don't want to invest in a taxable account until you've maxed out your tax protected options.

As a general rule, you use a pre-tax/tax-deferred/traditional 401(k) during your peak earnings years and Roth 401(k) contributions in other years.

https://www.whitecoatinvestor.com/should-you-make-roth-or-traditional-401k-contributions/

You still don't seem convinced that active management is a losing strategy. This post might help:

https://www.whitecoatinvestor.com/people-still-believe-in-active-management/

This is not a debate. It's settled. The data is very clear.

If you'd like your own "program" to calculate what your accounts will grow to, I'd suggest this one (you probably already own it):

https://www.whitecoatinvestor.com/compound-interest-the-excel-future-value-fv-function/

I sent you an email last night that I hope will help you. As others have said, this is not an advisory relationship worth preserving. People have been pretty much unanimous about that for a reason.

[Panscan]

Idk why you're trying to convince this person to change their strategy. Just find someone else. You seem strangely pre occupied with utilizing their services. I understand you have a decent amount of time invested but the more time you invest the harder it will eventually be to cut cord. You shouldn't have to convince someone you're paying that they're wrong about what you're paying them for.

Like many have said, your situation isnt that complex financially. I feel like you have bought into a notion that it's super complex and requires professional help. It really doesn't. Does that mean you are ready to tackle it all by yourself tomorrow? No, of course not. But with time you easily can.

[octopus85]

Panscan wrote:

Idk why you’re trying to convince this person to change their strategy. Just find someone else. You seem strangely pre occupied with utilizing their services. I understand you have a decent amount of time invested but the more time you invest the harder it will eventually be to cut cord. You shouldn’t have to convince someone you’re paying that they’re wrong about what you’re paying them for.

Like many have said, your situation isnt that complex financially. I feel like you have bought into a notion that it’s super complex and requires professional help. It really doesn’t. Does that mean you are ready to tackle it all by yourself tomorrow? No, of course not. But with time you easily can.

Click to expand...

+1...

This guy only gets paid by doing the opposite of what's best for you. You will never convince him that he's "wrong". Stop trying.

[noncontributory comment removed by moderator]

[Tim]

The White Coat Investor wrote:

People have been pretty much unanimous about that for a reason.

Click to expand...

Hmmm, I wonder if the FA suggests LTD wrapper on a whole life policy?

[JWeb]

OP, you seem to be wanting everyone to tell you to keep this FA for some reason. That's not going to happen.

You don't want to pay much in fees but already pay $1400. So find a FA that you can pay hourly up to $1400 for the advice. I think that would be worth A LOT to you.

Many financially savvy people (including WCI himself!!) have asked you multiple questions that you have refused to answer for some reason. They can't help you if you don't answer them.

So sit down with an hourly FA that you find on WCI and go from there. We have been talking in circles for 4 pages on this thread.

[q-school]

this is such a fascinating thread to me.  I almost feel it should be locked but I don't really know why.

there hasn't been any offensive language, no threats were made, but I feel it is at a stalemate and no good can come from continuing it.

hmmm

[JWeb]

q-school wrote:

I almost feel it should be locked but I don’t really know why.

Click to expand...

I had that same thought!

[Drop it into MD]

I keep starting to comment then deleting my post when the phrase "if you do not have something nice to say do not say anything at all"  pops into my head.

[Snag75]

Wow, gotta say my immediate reaction after logging on tonight is just "This is an interesting demographic!" [N.B. I admin several online groups of very intelligent, strong, and opinionated people all over the country and world, but this is a first for me.  Kinda surprised at the emotional reactions by those who have it all figured out, and not used to this odd judgment by those getting their panties in a twist because I’m not giving full detailed information in an online public forum on their timeline (not like I have a job or kids or anything).  Remarks redacted by moderator, direct insults, egging each other on...from a group of adults, successful physicians no less?  Wow.  Good thing I’m thick-skinned and used to big egos, but you boys are something else.]

Ok, sorry that stuff is just so amazing and distracting to me -- back to the facts at hand...

I suppose the situation is that at this point I “moved in with” this guy because at the time (like, last month!) it was my best and fastest option to get out from under an even worse situation – meanwhile I suddenly have several timely decisions to make on topics that are new to me and I have found it helpful to have someone to discuss them with.  Clearly I am still doing my own research and not buying into whatever he suggests as the final decisions on anything is still always mine (Think logically McDreamys: When you see a patient for a second opinion, do you spend 90% of your visit with them berating their choice of their first opinion? They came to see you for a reason! Given an objective opinion on the facts at hand, obviously if they were completely in bed with Doc#1 you wouldn't be talking to them in the first place!).  I get the feeling that many respondents here have such an emotional reaction to things that it unfortunately overshadows the education/opinions they could just instead impart directly (assuming I'm of sound mind and can analyze different sets of data from different sources), plus I waste time explaining and defending a situation I have already admitted is not ideal.

Again, my plan is to get educated enough to feel comfortable to be completely DIY, or at least just with specific questions here and there coming from a more educated base.  I cannot do that immediately while working 3 jobs and raising 2 young kids on my own right before the holidays and end of the tax year – the amount of time I have spent on this stuff in the past week has been more than I’ve been able to manage in the past decade, so this will be a ongoing journey, not a switch I can flip overnight.

My question about the $1400+/yr, was basically my thoughts on justifying this expense temporarily, given my viable alternatives.  I could fire him tomorrow, spend several more hours prepping for and setting up another account, moving my funds again, getting help in reallocating (and then lose a couple thousand in revenue from my other work that I keep putting off), and then spend $200-500/hr getting similar questions sorted in the upcoming weeks/months.  But, given the logistics and other priorities, I don’t think that’s a prudent use of my time and resources.  As much as it makes sense in the LONGTERM to get out from under this FA AND to not trust the advice given, I would lose more than I gain during this time of flux.

My expectation is once I have a bit more handle on things (and the bandaid-fixes and immediate decisions are done with, each with their own sets of education processes to wade through), I will feel more comfortable with an exit strategy to DIY life, and then can hopefully make better use of a fee-only advisor’s time (and better use of the fees!) in helping sort out the rest.  Regardless, I will be doing my own research (fee-only or not), so if I’m paying top dollar for advice, I want to make sure my questions are as informed as possible and I’m not in scrambling-mode as I am now.

Of course in the meantime I don’t want to make any ill-advised decisions, nor suffer significant losses re: my current holdings either.  I have to get electronic access to the info (just got the tools for that tonight) and, frankly, have time to do it.  If it seems that even for the next couple months these holdings are bad for my bottom line (short-term anyway), I will have to act accordingly.  Otherwise I need to triage my various issues as time allows given their various deadlines (and my other obligations of course).

I have not answered every question immediately because some are very detailed and need a thoughtful comprehensive answer, and frankly I have direct care responsibilities all but ~8hrs a day (and some of those I need to eat and sleep -- I also have another job (work from home) that I’ve neglected this week due to all this that I need to re-focus on some).  Throwing up my entire financial picture (which includes a good amount of personal information) in a quick response somehow is not something I am really prepared for off the top of my head while on the go all day.  Plus y’all aren’t the only savvy folk I’ve been talking to, so there just aren’t enough hours in the day.  It's not that I'm "refusing" to provide information (sorry man, that's a comment I'd expect from a pre-millenial troll trying to bait me, not a savvy physician investor). I wear several hats all day, maybe it's just different from your lifestyle, not something to take personally.

Again, appreciate the help (at least that which I can surgically isolate from the various colorful and impractical commentary).  I would suggest considering that just because someone is in a situation that you find unfavorable and can’t imagine being in for more than 5 seconds, and you don’t understand their reasons for remaining for the time being, doesn’t make them unintelligent, nor resistant to your advice.  This scenario comes up so often in so many other facets of life, perhaps you’ve just been unaware when you were in them too.  You really don’t know whom you’re dealing with, so objective opinions and patience would be more helpful.  If your goal is not to help, then there’s nothing wrong with keeping silent too.

Once I can get more info on my holdings that provide more useful information, I will try to share.  Not sure if this is the best format for that?  And as I sort out these other immediate issues, I will continue to research and learn – expect more questions, and I will get my instruments ready to lyse through the rhetoric and hopefully excise the helpful tips and information which I know are in there.  But I gotta get up again in 3.5hrs (for another 16hr day) and my Bovie hand is a little worn right now, so will have to get back to you.  Thanks again to those who are open to help.

[jacoavlu]

Ok. Are there any specific questions we can answer for you?

[Snag75]

Yes, but they've clearly been buried under the rhetoric and flaming.
Again, simultaneously with my immediate issues going on, I wanted to get a handle on where my money is currently and if it's really not recommended as is (for now). Have several vehicles, only one under FA.
How can I share the relevant info for review?

[jacoavlu]

See here:

https://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6212

[Kamban]

Snag75 wrote:

I admin several online groups of very intelligent, strong, and opinionated people all over the country and world, but this is a first for me. Kinda surprised at the emotional reactions by those who have it all figured out, and not used to this odd judgment by those getting their panties in a twist because I’m not giving full detailed information in an online public forum on their timeline (not like I have a job or kids or anything). Remarks redacted by moderator, direct insults, egging each other on…from a group of adults, successful physicians no less? Wow. Good thing I’m thick-skinned and used to big egos, but you boys are something else

Click to expand...

I am not taking the bait and falling into a trap by your passive-aggressive approach. Many of us asked many times for details, on which action can be taken that can help you, but yet you find time to post long posts without any relevant details and accuse us of bad behavior and having our panties in a twist.

Good luck with whatever route you take. I am bowing out of this thread.